Torquay United Fans Forum

Campbell scored on Tuesday but I actually thought his overal contribution was very poor. I would have subbed him, not bowman.

We constantly ask bowman to be a complete striker, when really he is more a decent goal scorer. He needs someone physical with him which is why, in my opinion, he looked good yesterday - he was allowed to do what he's good at.

Anyway, back to the point of not giving CH praise. I was actually a latecomer to the CH is crap bandwagon. Early in the season I was derided by others for my excuse making and saying how he needs more time. However he has continued to make strange decisions and inadequately manage the team. It took me well over 40 games (including last season) for ,e to get to the point where I think he is not good enough to manage our football club. I think you will agree that is a considered position. Therefore, excuse me when I don't change my mind after ONE GAME.

I congratulate Chris and his squad, and I enjoyed winning and supported my team throughout the game, but one win will not make me suddenly change my mind about all the evidence I have seen over a seasons worth of games. Chris will have to now oversee a marked improvement between now and the end of the season for me to get to reconsider. I think that's perfectly fair.

Bowman has been absolutely woeful lately - it doesn't matter if he's our best striker. You're picked on form and he deserved to be dropped. Maybe that was the kick up the backside that he needed. By all accounts, Campbell did ok against Braintree and scored our goal so I think Hargreaves made the right selection. I actually think our best partnership is Bowman and O'Achie - they were a handful earlier in the season. Hopefully O'Achie will come back into the fold soon after his recent family bereavement. And let's hope this is a turning point for Bowman. I've criticised Hargreaves in recent weeks but will give credit where it's due and yesterday he did well.

But lately Bowman has not been holding the ball up and performing like he did yesterday. I'm not putting it down as some sort of managerial master stroke but it does feel that CH is damned if he does and damned if he doesn't at the moment. He picked Cambell after Tuesday's debacle as he was better than Bowman on the night. That seems reasonable to me. You may not be one of them, but there are plenty iof people in the Plainmoor crowd who seem to have a real problem with Bowmen as he is a frustrating character. Whatever the reason, he looked back to his best yesterday and for that both he and the manager deserve some credit if they are to both get slaughtered when performances dip.
I'm just trying to ask for fairness as lately CH seems to be taking all the blame for the state of the club which I think is over the top.

'The biggest difference was having a player up front who could hold the ball and take the pressure of the centre midfield. I am not going to give CH credit for a masterstroke of tactical genius when he is the last person in Torquay to see that it was the right thing to do.'

From my comments I was obviously not one of the people who wanted Bowman dropped. He is by far and away our best striker, and it completely baffles me how anyone could consider leaving him out considering our 'replacements' .

I am always willing to give credit where it's due, however I didn't see much yesterday that was about Hargreaves. Most people on here seem to have noticed months ago that Briscoe and Bowman is the best CF pairing we have, for example (as shown yesterday), but CH won't settle on one pairing and it only happened yesterday due to fate.

There were some improved performances yesterday - young and Dawson, for example - but there were plenty of average ones too. Credit to Ajala for keeping going but his end product was poor for most of the game, Cameron may as well not have played.

The biggest difference was having a player up front who could hold the ball and take the pressure of the centre midfield. I am not going to give CH credit for a masterstroke of tactical genius when he is the last person in Torquay to see that it was the right thing to do.

Kit_robin wrote:
No he didn't. He left our best striker, who scored both our goals, On the bench. Hargreaves got lucky - I've seen nothing from Campbell to suggest he can put in a performance anywhere near the level of Bowman's today.

Yet another example of fans never being prepared to give any credit. I suspect you were one of the many who were happy to see Bowman dropped after a recent dip in form (to put it mildly). Maybe dropping him to bench was exactly what he needed to turn things around. We will never know but the churlish sniping at CH after an improved performance just looks petty in my view

gullno4 wrote:He got it right today!

No he didn't. He left our best striker, who scored both our goals, On the bench. Hargreaves got lucky - I've seen nothing from Campbell to suggest he can put in a performance anywhere near the level of Bowman's today.

eddyh wrote:There really is some rubbish posted on here. Firstly I very much doubt that the posters who quote £100K per year have the first idea what CH actually earns but it almost certainly is nowhere near that. Secondly the nonsense about a rolling contract is just incorrect. He sighed a two and half year contract that runs out June 16. Lastly, the absolutely ludicrous idea that football managers could have a contract the same as us in the rest of the working world is laughable. Firstly employyment law does not just allow for people to be sacked on a whim and secondly, notice periods work both ways. Had he been a rip roaring success would you really be happy for him to hand in his 3 months notice and leave with us getting next to no compensation? Buckle got slaughtered for leaving us but the compensation we recieved was pretty welcome as I remember it. Football does not work the same as other jobs but it's much more fun to post inaccuracies than try to understand that I guess.

There really is some rubbish posted on here. Firstly I very much doubt that the posters who quote £100K per year have the first idea what CH actually earns but it almost certainly is nowhere near that. Secondly the nonsense about a rolling contract is just incorrect. He sighed a two and half year contract that runs out June 16. Lastly, the absolutely ludicrous idea that football managers could have a contract the same as us in the rest of the working world is laughable. Firstly employyment law does not just allow for people to be sacked on a whim and secondly, notice periods work both ways. Had he been a rip roaring success would you really be happy for him to hand in his 3 months notice and leave with us getting next to no compensation? Buckle got slaughtered for leaving us but the compensation we recieved was pretty welcome as I remember it. Football does not work the same as other jobs but it's much more fun to post inaccuracies than try to understand that I guess.

I, like everyone else am feeling delighted with the win today, I do not want to seem as if I'm trying to detract or taking anything away from the win, but come on, as said in the match thread, Kidderminster were one of the few teams in worse form that us, they hadn't scored in 601 minutes prior to this game, their players apparently haven't been paid for a few weeks now. If Chris Hargreaves couldn't get it right today, he never would, ever.

Win at Woking this Tuesday, now that would be a stand up take notice type of result, wouldn't it.

He got it right today!

Orange Gull wrote:He was also retweeting a lot from fans last week. Thought this was interesting.

He followed me back which was nice. Lingy

Good point Neal. Most of us the real world have some form of performance targets built in nowadays, if not met its goodbye. Why can't our managers have that? E.g. Top half finish etc etc.

No doubt I will get slaughtered on here for merely suggesting it.......

Thinking about it, It was muted that CH was in the running for a job at Northampton. Good luck to them if they were willing to pay 100k for a 2nd in charge, youth coach or whatever job it was.

You are right there is a stress to the job of football manager yes, and yes its a tough one.

But CH is not a child, he knew very well what he was getting into, and what pressures might fall on his family. He should have considered all that before he accepted the job. So although I have some sympathy on a human level I don't on a professional level.

The problem with football management it is a "public" results business. Most of our jobs are as well, mine is a results business (not public), my job is not being monitored by 2000 people, only about 3 for me.

I really do hope we stop paying stupid wages and giving rolling contracts. We have been here before with this argument and some of you think if we wont get quality if we don't give contracts like this. I disagree, look at the record, we have paid of the last 2 managers and more than likely will have to do the same again. A club like Torquay cant keep on doing that! If you advertised the job at 50k with a normal contract (like most of us have) with a 3 month payout if you get sacked. You will get a host of people applying. AND do you really think some of these will be any worse than what we have had, I don't!