Torquay United Fans Forum

There's an old saying: 'you have to speculate to accumulate' (probably originated by a bookmaker) !

arcadia wrote:Does anyone know how much we are losing each week as it's all gone quiet. Is anyone interested in buying the club?

Well I'm interested but I'm a few million short! Wanna chip in?

Does anyone know how much we are losing each week as it's all gone quiet. Is anyone interested in buying the club?

Torquay United Fans Ltd is no more. Now trading as Homes for All Investments Limited:

https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/09895878

News of Thea resigning from the board of Plainmoor Ltd almost as soon as she went back on:

https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/comp ... ng-history

And of the shirt sponsor. How about a pink dolphin on the front of the shirt?

https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/07118514

I've just made my first players fund donation of £50. I'll make another similar sized donation at the half way point in the season thereby contributing the overall total of £300 which I had always assumed to be the price of a season ticket.

I was very critical of such a large discount under the earlybird offer but at least I have put my money where my mouth is!

I've been a supporter for around 30 years but have never bought a season ticket holder until this year because it just wasn't worth it due to the number of games I wouldn't be able to make. This year it does make sense so all 4 of us that attend together have made the decision to buy one.

That will mean that I attend more games and spend more money with the club, I stopped going in Boots & Laces a few years ago and switched to the Gulls Nest to help the club, but they need to up their game to make even more money. It takes so long to get a drink at half time that some people give up, they need to go back to pre pouring some before half time or at least let everyone know you can pre-order half time drinks.

Needing a cash injection was always going to be a consequence, of the G.I takeover collapsing, regardless of whether they were the wrong buyers or whether the club wasted vital time, surely there has to be an understanding that our club, and clubs of a similar stature can no longer fund themselves on gate income alone, two choices now, we either find a rich sugar daddy who doesn't mind losing money, or the club put it's self on a footing where by it can not spend any more than £1 for every £1 it earns, which may see us a National league premier/South club for while, that's reality I'm afraid, seriously enjoy every minute of this season ahead, beyond that, unless something changes, who knows.

As for the season ticket deal, I see both sides of the argument here, of course the club needs cash flow through out the season, but to me it's about guaranteed income, your football fan can be as fickle as your supermarket shopper.

If the club had priced season tickets at £400 there's no guarantee they'd have sold 400 tickets, there's no guarantee the additional 600 season ticket holders would have paid at the gate , It's all down to results and performances. I do not know, if I can attend any match's past the end of September, had the season tickets been priced at the normal level I would not have brought one, at £200 I did, my way of supporting the club, knowing I might not use it past September.

Gloomy Gull wrote:Maybe there is a cash injection "in the wings"........I followed a car with the Reg TR10 URO out of the swimming pool car park last night !!

Well Masters was in the Directors' Box last night but for what reason?

Jerry wrote: I don't think anybody expects people to pay money they can't afford Hector. I can afford to contribute as I had already allocated money towards a £300 season ticket.

As for getting no return.... the return is surely better players and thus a better standard of football?

Let's be honest if we hadn't had a players fund last season we would be in the Conference South now (or liquidated) with GI owning the club and readying the bulldozers.

Not sure what accountability you expect? Surely we just have to trust the football experts (Nicholson) to spend the money wisely? Who do you suggest is better qualified to make that call?

You are right of course, we have to hope and trust KN to use the money wisely but my point is that supporters are being asked to contribute to the running costs of a football club that is one of the biggest in the division because of poor decisions around recruitment that people (directors and managers) at the club have made in the past. Imagine Alan Knill or Chris Hargreaves wasting the Players Fund. It's only luck we have a manager who we trust has the interests of the club at heart.

Supporter Representation would help ensure that there is more transparency in relation to how any funds are used, to how decisions to appoint managers and recruit players are made. Having an elected supporter representative on the board is the least the club should offer if they want fans to subsidise the football club.

Maybe there is a cash injection "in the wings"........I followed a car with the Reg TR10 URO out of the swimming pool car park last night !!

hector wrote: I could chuck money I don't have into the Players' Fund but this doesn't sit easily with me.

Therefore, supporters are the one making the investment, yet are getting nothing in return. Supporters are being asked to hand over money (and with some saying they pay £25 per month - that is not insignificant amounts) but there is not accountability measure to ensure that their money is being used wisely or is getting good value.

I don't think anybody expects people to pay money they can't afford Hector. I can afford to contribute as I had already allocated money towards a £300 season ticket.

As for getting no return.... the return is surely better players and thus a better standard of football?

Let's be honest if we hadn't had a players fund last season we would be in the Conference South now (or liquidated) with GI owning the club and readying the bulldozers.

Not sure what accountability you expect? Surely we just have to trust the football experts (Nicholson) to spend the money wisely? Who do you suggest is better qualified to make that call?

I bought a season-ticket this season, when I didn't last year for the first time in many years. Last season I actually quite enjoyed the freedom of not feeling committed to attending or otherwise feeling I would be wasting my money like I did when I had a season-ticket and didn't attend for whatever reason. With the dreadful football that was on offer as well, I missed more home games last season than I had done for any season since around 92/93 when I lived in London and couldn't attend. Last season was the first season I was choosing to do other things on match days since the dark days of David Webb in 1985.

I will miss plenty of games this season as well, as I find it difficult to get to Tuesday night games and with all the rearranged games that occur, then there will be plenty of matches missed. Therefore, the club is probably making more out of me, even at £200 for a season-ticket, compared to if I attended the same amount of fixtures as last season (even though I anticipate that I am unlikely to miss quite so many games this year).

I could chuck money I don't have into the Players' Fund but this doesn't sit easily with me. There is something a bit rich about directors/fellow fans (apparently) - with their investment allegedly untouched - making decisions (of which we are kept in the dark re: GI and Peter Masters) asking supporters to fund some of the running costs on top of what they already pay at the gate. Yet, not one concession of supporter representation is offered in return.

Therefore, supporters are the one making the investment, yet are getting nothing in return. Supporters are being asked to hand over money (and with some saying they pay £25 per month - that is not insignificant amounts) but there is not accountability measure to ensure that their money is being used wisely or is getting good value.

If this board of supposed fellow fans, really wants to be conciliatory towards supporters that they have really not treated very well at all, then stop acting like the pigs in Animal Farm and let there be true Supporter Representation at board level. It is time for the club to work meaningfully with TUST, not in the token, 'brush them off' way they did last season, with Peter Masters calling the shots. This football club is nothing to do with him and everything to do with the supporters and it should be the supporters who are given a chance to run things in the absence of a credible investor who does not have dubious motives in the way GI did.

I take that point, but it does assume we average the same as we did last year. With the cheaper prices, and much higher standard of football we could very easily be well into the 2000s even with an average year. An extra 300 at an average of even £10 a head is an extra £70k across the season. As stated above, there will be several season ticket holders not attending every game that have bought one purely because the deal is good and they want to support the club.

Between the absent season ticket holders and higher attendances we should be pretty close to last season. Throw in the extra marketing of the player's fund to 1000+ season ticket holders and this should be well above last year.

With the TUST possibly getting more involved and new investors being sought we've got several new streams of potential income to explore.

We're not going to average 2800, but this a good target for several of the early season games, taking advantage of the great escape momentum and feel good factor.

Also worth remembering that several gates last year were in the low 1000s, that's only 700 to 800 paying on the gate, and boosted by bigger gates at Christmas and during the run-in.

It will be an experiment for the club at least, and it will be interesting to see what next year's prices are set as. Possibly a £250 compromise might be an option if we don't offer another bargain or revert back to previous £300+.

SteveDeckchair wrote:People are failing to see that on 1,800 crowds that means last year we had 1,400 paying on the day (roughly), which is income all through the year. We now will only have potentially 800 people paying on the gate through the year. That means a massive drop in income. To demonstrate where I am coming from, my back of a fag packet calcs (using estimates).

Last year
400 (season tickets) x £300 = £120k
1,400 (pay on the gate) x 23 (home games) x £15 (average as we have a load of old codgers supporting us) = £483k

£603k total

This year
1000 x £200 = £200k
800 x 23 x £15 = £276k

£476k total.

You are gambling on the 600 new season ticket holders spending an additional £125k across the year. That is a massive gap to plug. 3,250 additional shirts sold. 35,750 additional pints in the gulls nest. 42,000 additional pies sold.

Be interested to see how much people put in the fund now, but it is needed more than ever, make no mistake.

Maths eh.......

I guess most of us are hoping for an improvment on the paltry 1800 avaerage attendance last season. We know we can get bigger crowds than that and based on the roughly 2400 home fans at last nights friendly we will get more than that turning up, especially if Nicho and his band of men can fullfill some of their potential and be scrapping at the other end of the table to where we were last year.


Edit: And yes, I have taken my rose rinted spectacles out of the drawer, given them a thorough polish and have them very comfortably sitting on my nose :P

People are failing to see that on 1,800 crowds that means last year we had 1,400 paying on the day (roughly), which is income all through the year. We now will only have potentially 800 people paying on the gate through the year. That means a massive drop in income. To demonstrate where I am coming from, my back of a fag packet calcs (using estimates).

Last year
400 (season tickets) x £300 = £120k
1,400 (pay on the gate) x 23 (home games) x £15 (average as we have a load of old codgers supporting us) = £483k

£603k total

This year
1000 x £200 = £200k
800 x 23 x £15 = £276k

£476k total.

You are gambling on the 600 new season ticket holders spending an additional £125k across the year. That is a massive gap to plug. 3,250 additional shirts sold. 35,750 additional pints in the gulls nest. 42,000 additional pies sold.

Be interested to see how much people put in the fund now, but it is needed more than ever, make no mistake.

Maths eh.......