Torquay United Fans Forum

Fonda wrote: That day out at Old Trafford didn't do us any favours.

I don't know - I hear Rooney is unhappy......

SouthamptonGull wrote:
You're not on your own, I agree with you 100%

I said before he signed, while he was with us and after he left, the man is quality in this division. Sure, he can look lethargic at times, but the guy knows where the onion bag is and more often than not, hits the damned thing. I love Brnyon for his commitment, work ethic and the way he always tries to close players down. If we were to play to HIS strengths, he'd score plenty, instead of that we ask him to play as a targetman and that isn't where his attributes lie, even though he tries admirably hard in my opinion.I'm full of praise for Shane for never backing down in his conviction that Benyon was a good player when many of us, myself included, could only see the weaker points of his game. He's adapted well to League football and is definitely a player I want on my side.

As for Branston, if his all-round game was as good as his leadership, he wouldn't be playing this low down the pyramid, lay off the guy ffs. He's been one of our most consistent performers since he arrived, he's done something that nobody else was able to, and that's make sure Ellis was given a regular starting berth, talk of dropping him is ridiculous.

Completely agree Dave. We already have a player that can score goals at this level, but we're not playing in a manner that gets the best from him. The signs were promising on Saturday, with Kee used more as the 'target' (and considering his height, i thought he did an excellent job of it). I hope that experiment is given more time, because i think it could work. Rendell performed that role brilliantly, and it was a real shame we couldn't afford to get him here permanently.

Fonda wrote: The answer (if the question was meant to about the manager) is very obviously no at this stage.

But regarding the point above, i think perhaps Bucks does have to take some responsibility. We were sailing serenly along after the first 4 games, and our problems have been created since the manager unecessarily started tinkering with formations. Is it a coincidence that we're struggling to achieve any kind of consistency when we don't play the same way from one game to the next? I'm not sure it is...

The way Bucks has got this team playing at times this season is an indication that he remains the right man for the job. But he seems to have convinced himself football suddenly got very complicated. That day out at Old Trafford didn't do us any favours.

EDIT: I've just read the rest of this thread, and am once again staggered at the short-sighted views of Benyons performance. He worked hard (as always) and didn't miss any chances. The chance described above - he did everything right. He held the ball because (and this is opinion) he was waiting for an opportunity to feed Kee. Unfortunately (and i was directly in line), that chance didn't seem to arise. So he took the shot (from an, at this point narrow angle)and hit the target. Credit the keeper for making himself 'big'. Even if he did delay too long in trying to make the pass, was everyone else on the pitch so perfect that he deserves specific criticism for one mistake...? Of course there was the hand-ball incident, and i wouldn't condone that, but there isn't a player in the world that would have scored that and not claimed it.

Their form has dipped as well, and their world class granny humper has gone to bits.

The question is What did Bucks say to Sir Alex?

SouthamptonGull wrote:I said before he signed, while he was with us and after he left, the man is quality in this division. Sure, he can look lethargic at times, but the guy knows where the onion bag is and more often than not, hits the damned thing. I love Brnyon for his commitment, work ethic and the way he always tries to close players down. If we were to play to HIS strengths, he'd score plenty, instead of that we ask him to play as a targetman and that isn't where his attributes lie, even though he tries admirably hard in my opinion.

Wycombe fans aren't too impressed from what I've read, and he's certainly not starting week in, week out. I just wonder if there's a chance they could cut their losses and get rid? I've got no doubt that he'd jump at the chance to come back here.

On Benyon, the last couple of months from last season is the only time I watched him and thought 'wow, this lad actually looks the real deal'. It's no coincedence that he was playing alongside Rendell during that time. They were a fantastic partnership and I honestly think if Rendell was a TUFC player we'd be in the Top 7 now.

shaunicus wrote:The Pickler. He's beginning to look a bit exposed, isn't he? It's clear he struggles against mobile, pacy strikers. Having said that, there's no-one I'd want more marking 'Kinfatwat on Saturday than Branston with a point to prove. With the weather and pitches getting worse over the winter months, Branston will still provide value - especially on a cold and wet Tuesday night.

O'Kane. I can't fault his enthusiasm but he's not a central midfielder. He doesn't have the disipline to play that role - especially in a 4-4-2. Unfortunately we were spoilt with Alex Russell and the clamour to continue playing a 'creative midfielder' will continue, despite the fact barely anyone else in this division has one, and we're not Brazil. Give me the solid and unspectacular Wroe over the flashy O'Kane any day of the week.

Oh, and am I the only one who would take Rendell back in a heartbeat? Someone with a bit of height who can link the play in the final third and score goals. Not disputing he was horribly overpriced but missing out on him was a huge blow that we're yet to recover from. Benyon never looked better than when he was alongside Rendell.

You're not on your own, I agree with you 100%

I said before he signed, while he was with us and after he left, the man is quality in this division. Sure, he can look lethargic at times, but the guy knows where the onion bag is and more often than not, hits the damned thing. I love Brnyon for his commitment, work ethic and the way he always tries to close players down. If we were to play to HIS strengths, he'd score plenty, instead of that we ask him to play as a targetman and that isn't where his attributes lie, even though he tries admirably hard in my opinion.

I'm full of praise for Shane for never backing down in his conviction that Benyon was a good player when many of us, myself included, could only see the weaker points of his game. He's adapted well to League football and is definitely a player I want on my side.

As for Branston, if his all-round game was as good as his leadership, he wouldn't be playing this low down the pyramid, lay off the guy ffs. He's been one of our most consistent performers since he arrived, he's done something that nobody else was able to, and that's make sure Ellis was given a regular starting berth, talk of dropping him is ridiculous.

Of course there was the hand-ball incident, and i wouldn't condone that, but there isn't a player in the world that would have scored that and not claimed it

I bet you wouldnt see wouldnt see someone like Henry try and claim one after a handball......errrrrrrr

forevertufc wrote:I think this is a fair and relevant question to ask.The answer.....no.

I think the current run of results is not the fault of Buckle,look at the number of times we have hit the post, stevenage,shrewsbury etc,home to aldershot thought we were the better team and should have won,today deserved a point,and credit bury to me the best attacking side we have seen so far this season,apart from macc home the team have been playing quite well,and could easily had atleast 5 more points if not more from this run.

Also take into account the playing budget was allready small before it was cut,Buckle largly has his hands tied,and even if we could afford the better players,it is not that easy to attract them to come and play for TUFC.

All in all in think Buckle is doing a good job,and who else could the club attract as manager on our playing budget location etc,who would or could do a better job.

The answer (if the question was meant to about the manager) is very obviously no at this stage.

But regarding the point above, i think perhaps Bucks does have to take some responsibility. We were sailing serenly along after the first 4 games, and our problems have been created since the manager unecessarily started tinkering with formations. Is it a coincidence that we're struggling to achieve any kind of consistency when we don't play the same way from one game to the next? I'm not sure it is...

The way Bucks has got this team playing at times this season is an indication that he remains the right man for the job. But he seems to have convinced himself football suddenly got very complicated. That day out at Old Trafford didn't do us any favours.

EDIT: I've just read the rest of this thread, and am once again staggered at the short-sighted views of Benyons performance. He worked hard (as always) and didn't miss any chances. The chance described above - he did everything right. He held the ball because (and this is opinion) he was waiting for an opportunity to feed Kee. Unfortunately (and i was directly in line), that chance didn't seem to arise. So he took the shot (from an, at this point narrow angle)and hit the target. Credit the keeper for making himself 'big'. Even if he did delay too long in trying to make the pass, was everyone else on the pitch so perfect that he deserves specific criticism for one mistake...? Of course there was the hand-ball incident, and i wouldn't condone that, but there isn't a player in the world that would have scored that and not claimed it.

Guys,

Lets not panic just yet. We played plenty well enough yesterday to have earned something out of the game (as we did against Aldershot and Crewe, to name but two). The starting XI on the pitch yesterday is our best XI.
Scotty B had no chance with any of the shots. Penalty is a coin flip, 25 yard screamer right in the corner which may or may not have taken a small deflection off Mark Ellis. a goal from the boy who may well be the replacement for Ryan Giggs in a couple of years time and a quick break against a team (us) pushing for a winner at 3-3 which took a horrible deflection off the attending defender. The stats say that Bury had 4 shots on target and scored 4 goals, not a lot Bevs can do.
The back 5 were not at their imperious best, but they weren't a total train wreck either. Pickles has conceded 3 penners in 1.5 games and was rightly taken off at half time. It wasn't a bright thing to do, but then, the same thing was done to Benyon 10 minutes later and no penalty was awarded, go figure. Two wrongs do not make a right, but it would be nice if the referee was consistent.
Robbo did as well as could be expected when faced with a kid who is on loan from one of the best two or three clubs on Earth, he wasn't exactly 'the Weak Link'. Mark Ellis got perhaps a little excited at times, but was largely the six-figure player we know and love. Charnock, when he came on, looked slightly rusty once or twice, but what do we expect for a guy who plays so little, I challenge any other of our benchers to do as good a job on 10 mins notice and no game time. Nico was good yesterday, he seems to get better every week and he is certainly more confident on the ball than he was last year.

Danny Stevens was particularly good yesterday. Considering Bury pride themselves on being a team built on pace, Danny certainly seemed capable of blitzing past their wingers time and again. EoK was less effective than he has been of late, but this was due, almost entirely, to our very pleasing habit of getting the ball wide. Manse was everyone's man of the match, but didn't get the award because he didn't score and Zedders did. He made two silly mistakes in letting the ball roll under his feet, but then I'm not perfect either. Zedders was super, even when Bury started doubling up on him midway through the first half.

Now, the contentious two, Billy Kee and Benners.

Billy: This sounds mad, but stick with it. If you treat Billy as a player, not a goal scorer, he becomes a much better prospect. His close control is good, he is weak in a lot of areas, I'm not saying he is the bees knees, but he is a good hold up man provided the ball is played in to his feet and not to his head. But for Benyon's hopelessness/selfishness yesterday, he'd have had his opening goal. I like him, he needs to toughen up a little and use that massive frame to his advantage and he will be a real asset to this club. Forgets ye not, he is a mere 19 years of age (Which, rather alarmingly, makes him clear of 5 years younger than me...GIT!)

Elliot: Oh man, where to start with this guy? I want to like him, I want him to be the answer to our prayers, but it just seems he isn't doing it right now. Yes, he has scored a few goals so far this year, but some of the chances he misses are absolutely criminal. The one-on-one on Saturday was a real case in point. What the hell did he think he was doing taking the ball to within a yard of the keeper before poking it tamely at his chest. I would expect more composure from Danny Potter in the situation. I know it's easy from the Pop side, but I would surely expect a professional striker to be able to find the top corner or the 5 hole or indeed the square ball to Billy for the tap in.

In conclusion, there is absolutely no need to tinker the team at all, if it ain't broke (I mean really broke, not just a little bit wibble) then don't fix it. Keep playing the way we are, teach Benyon some composure and finishing and we will soon start picking up some good points.

Howay the Lads.

Matt.

I think we should give Bucks more time. Sure it annoys me when he turns out the same predictable excuses like 'we were the better side today' or 'we could have scored five or six' or 'mistakes cost us' on an all too regular basis. in some games it is true yes, but it gets tiresome. That said though, i think he has attributes that can be of benefit to us in the long term if we just stick with him. I mean if Bucks is not to be given time then why should Billy Kee cos he ain't delivering the goods at the minute is he? Very very disappointed with him. I remember the first time i saw him live away at Lincoln he looked overweight, sluggish, and was constantly knackered. Not happy at all at the minute and all the early season euphoria has worn off despite us being a couple of wins off a prom spot. We go from not conceding a goal for about a hundred years to shipping millions in 3 games!! Its doing my head in!! If we can steady the ship and nail a couple of wins soon then i will be hopeful of a play off spot. If we plummet down the table (which hasn't happened a great deal yet despite our atrocious run of form) then i'll have to review my opinions on Bucks. I do not want another relegation battle like last season. Although the 3-0 win at Grimsby provided me with one of my most enjoyable days last season!

YellowMurphy wrote:Nick, Coming in at half time against a front pairing like Ajose and Lowe isnt exactly the easiest scenario to come into. Look at their two second half goals, a wonder strike, and nico not getting tight enough on his man/a slight deflection. Charnock + Ellis should be the way forward. I remember about this time last season was when Nico got dropped for about a month or two, came back in the form of his career. Maybe that is what Branston needs.

i agree with you mate.

it did nicho the power of good.

i was livid after his dismal performance at crewe. gave them all three goals - although the first pen wasnt a pen. but the 2nd goal it was his header that went back to the middle of the pitch just before it ended up in our top corner.
then at the end he was all smiles and joking with the crewe players! FFS! :x

get him dropped, give charnock (who has the patience of a saint) a chance and that will give branston the kick up the a**e he deserves.

Nick, Coming in at half time against a front pairing like Ajose and Lowe isnt exactly the easiest scenario to come into. Look at their two second half goals, a wonder strike, and nico not getting tight enough on his man/a slight deflection. Charnock + Ellis should be the way forward. I remember about this time last season was when Nico got dropped for about a month or two, came back in the form of his career. Maybe that is what Branston needs.

C'mon are you serious? Are defence is scoring more goals at the moment than Benyon!

3 strikers isn't enough, especially when one is a first choice winger too. Zebs is 10 times more effective on the right than anywhere else on the pitch. If Benyon/Kee were to get injured, then who've we got? Yeoman? Move Zebs up the middle where he doesn't enjoy playing as much?

I agree with Gritton going back, but I can't see it happening until PB lines up a suitable replacement - a targetman who can do the dirty work.

And dropping Branston for two dodgy games? Charnock was no better yesterday.

Exactly, Benyon is the kind of breed of striker that can be quiet for a whole game, even over a spell of a few games, then easily score 2 or 3 in one game. We CANT keep on chopping and changing each week, a strong 4-4-2 got us that great start, no 3-5-1-1 or 4-5-1 or 4-3-3, no wing backs, no 5 in midfield, just 4-4-2. Benyon and Kee up top, Mansell and O'Kane in the middle, O'Kane just needs a few games, its not like hes had any horrific games. He cant do what he does in a 4-5-1 in a 4-4-2, he is limited in a 4-4-2, but he will fit in, Im pretty sure Lathrope would fit in perfectly, but for now, O'Kane gives us that extra bite going forward. As for Gritton, not bothered where he goes in January, hes good cover, and a good reserve striker. Hes good enough, but with Kee & Benyon I doubt he will get a good run in the side. He seems to have 10 minute spells where he wins a lot, and looks a threat then he just fizzles out. If Gritton goes back, that leaves us with 3 strikers:

Benyon
Kee
Zebs

I think we could get away with that. We just need to get a good partnership going between Kee & Benyon. Time is all we need, anyway were 11th? Its not like were going down.