About midway up directly behind the goal (about as central as possible to the goal).berkshire yellow wrote:I didn't hear someone moaning? where was he sat/stood?
Incredibly annoying.
Wycombe Wanderers v Torquay United - 12/10/13
Incredibly annoying.
Pea.
The first half was immensely positive, I would go so far as to say that was the best half of football we have played so far, if you take away the sloppy aberration for their equaliser we didn't really ever look in too much danger and looked like we could create chances at will- Azeez and Chappel causing plenty of problems throughout the half. Thought Lathrope was extremely effective in the first half and was the source of most of our good play, and having Pearce back was a calming presence at the back. Our first half lead was entirely merited, albeit against what I thought was a very pedestrian Wycombe.
After the match Ainsworth said he read his team the riot act at half time and made a couple of alterations to address the balance of play. It worked. I just hope that doesn't mean we are too predictable and easy to play against. I think in the second half it was more a case of Wycombe winning the match, rather than us throwing it away. Wycombe threw caution to the wind and attacked in numbers, and on a few occasions we were at sixes and sevens trying to stifle them. However, the flipside of this was that we looked dangerous on the counter attack but- as is so often the case this season- our final ball let us down.
For all our attacking intent and industry in the second half- we passed the ball around quickly and nicely- we did not work their goalkeeper once. If you can't do that, you don't deserve to win.
I will need to see the goals again because my view was not ideal, but the back line for both second half goals looked a bit of a mess with defenders being pulled out of position all over the place. It was a real shame because for 60 minutes of the match we had played so well.
I actually thought the game changed slightly on the withdrawal of Benyon, although it had no direct effect on their decisive goal, our goal threat lacked all potency when he came off. I don't know whether this was a move of caution, or whether the change to 451 was meant to maintain an attacking element but it didn't work. Although he didn't touch the ball very often, I thought some of Benyon's off the ball runs and anticipation were very intelligent and in turn allowed Azeez and Chapell to wreak havoc, when Benyon came off Azeez looked hardly a threat at all. I think plan A can work with our full strength team. I am yet to identify a plan B, if indeed we have one. A look at the bench today would tell me that we didn't.
Considering the amount of players out, and those returning at short notice, and those playing out of position we can be mightily proud of the shift our team put in today. I don't think we did enough to win, but I don't think we deserved to lose, defeat was a real sickener for me today, I think 2-2 was about fair, but I felt like I had seen a really good game of football.
If we play with the directness and intensity we showed in the first half, and also cut out the silly errors at the other end, we will be absolutely fine. If the silly errors have become manifested into our game and can't be eradicated, we will be in trouble. We can all call Shaun Taylor a useless manager, but I do think he was a fine defensive coach. This season we look like we can concede at any moment.
22nd place doesn't look good at all though, our fortunes have to change, soon. I think we need to see our manager really make a difference, if Ainsworth really walked into the changing room at half time and made a match-altering difference, well, I want our manager to do that too. If there are big decisions to be made, he needs to make them. My impression of him today, based on his demeanour, was that he wasn't sure how to change it around.
Overall though, very proud to call myself a gulls fans tonight, a really good day out
Pleasure to stand next to the mad Austrian (not Josef Fritzl) and to also put a face to the good name of TaxiLady. Thought the away crowd was excellent today, really gave a good go at trying to lift the team. 255 not a bad turn out considering our current plight. A decent noise made, my throat is killing me.
2 massive home games now, 3 points out of 6 is the minimum for me.
After the match Ainsworth said he read his team the riot act at half time and made a couple of alterations to address the balance of play. It worked. I just hope that doesn't mean we are too predictable and easy to play against. I think in the second half it was more a case of Wycombe winning the match, rather than us throwing it away. Wycombe threw caution to the wind and attacked in numbers, and on a few occasions we were at sixes and sevens trying to stifle them. However, the flipside of this was that we looked dangerous on the counter attack but- as is so often the case this season- our final ball let us down.
For all our attacking intent and industry in the second half- we passed the ball around quickly and nicely- we did not work their goalkeeper once. If you can't do that, you don't deserve to win.
I will need to see the goals again because my view was not ideal, but the back line for both second half goals looked a bit of a mess with defenders being pulled out of position all over the place. It was a real shame because for 60 minutes of the match we had played so well.
I actually thought the game changed slightly on the withdrawal of Benyon, although it had no direct effect on their decisive goal, our goal threat lacked all potency when he came off. I don't know whether this was a move of caution, or whether the change to 451 was meant to maintain an attacking element but it didn't work. Although he didn't touch the ball very often, I thought some of Benyon's off the ball runs and anticipation were very intelligent and in turn allowed Azeez and Chapell to wreak havoc, when Benyon came off Azeez looked hardly a threat at all. I think plan A can work with our full strength team. I am yet to identify a plan B, if indeed we have one. A look at the bench today would tell me that we didn't.
Considering the amount of players out, and those returning at short notice, and those playing out of position we can be mightily proud of the shift our team put in today. I don't think we did enough to win, but I don't think we deserved to lose, defeat was a real sickener for me today, I think 2-2 was about fair, but I felt like I had seen a really good game of football.
If we play with the directness and intensity we showed in the first half, and also cut out the silly errors at the other end, we will be absolutely fine. If the silly errors have become manifested into our game and can't be eradicated, we will be in trouble. We can all call Shaun Taylor a useless manager, but I do think he was a fine defensive coach. This season we look like we can concede at any moment.
22nd place doesn't look good at all though, our fortunes have to change, soon. I think we need to see our manager really make a difference, if Ainsworth really walked into the changing room at half time and made a match-altering difference, well, I want our manager to do that too. If there are big decisions to be made, he needs to make them. My impression of him today, based on his demeanour, was that he wasn't sure how to change it around.
Overall though, very proud to call myself a gulls fans tonight, a really good day out
Pleasure to stand next to the mad Austrian (not Josef Fritzl) and to also put a face to the good name of TaxiLady. Thought the away crowd was excellent today, really gave a good go at trying to lift the team. 255 not a bad turn out considering our current plight. A decent noise made, my throat is killing me.
2 massive home games now, 3 points out of 6 is the minimum for me.
Fair enough. If we 'd have got something out of the game, I wouldn't be so miserable tonight. My apologies.nickbrod wrote:The guy who shouts 'second ball' is me I think. I've coached footballers over 30+ years and frankly if we had during the game I reckon we would have gone home with at least a point.
At least I supported the team with as much vocal encouragement as I could.
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ferrarilover
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I wasn't going to say anything more about this game, but Sky Arts has lightened my mood.
We aren't the third worst side in the Football League, not by a damn sight. Wycombe are 9th and we are comfortably as good as they are in every aspect. Our first XI would have won the game today. Poke wouldn't have hesitated and cost us two goals and Downer (or O'Connor) wouldn't have allowed two of the three.
If ever two matches proved my point about there being different ways to lose a football match, it was the last two.
With our number one and a decent loanee defender to come back next weekend, it's only a matter of formality that we will begin climbing the league. We might not go too far, but we'll be well clear of the drop zone 6 weeks from now.
I think we'll see a striker come in on loan to do the Ball job (except he'll actually do it, rather than whatever it was Ball spent his time doing. Not a lot, from where I was standing). Harding and Benyon linked well today, but never managed to exploit a relatively deep and tight Wycombe back line (they must have been deep, Bennerz wasn't flagged all afternoon. A first?)
Matt.
We aren't the third worst side in the Football League, not by a damn sight. Wycombe are 9th and we are comfortably as good as they are in every aspect. Our first XI would have won the game today. Poke wouldn't have hesitated and cost us two goals and Downer (or O'Connor) wouldn't have allowed two of the three.
If ever two matches proved my point about there being different ways to lose a football match, it was the last two.
With our number one and a decent loanee defender to come back next weekend, it's only a matter of formality that we will begin climbing the league. We might not go too far, but we'll be well clear of the drop zone 6 weeks from now.
I think we'll see a striker come in on loan to do the Ball job (except he'll actually do it, rather than whatever it was Ball spent his time doing. Not a lot, from where I was standing). Harding and Benyon linked well today, but never managed to exploit a relatively deep and tight Wycombe back line (they must have been deep, Bennerz wasn't flagged all afternoon. A first?)
Matt.
J5 said, "ferrarilover is 100% correct"
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Scott Brehaut
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I say this purely because I'm an argumentative, pedantic arse, and because I've had a bastard of a day, however the quote above is incorrect.ferrarilover wrote: We aren't the third worst side in the Football League, not by a damn sight.
The league table, which can't lie, states that we are, currently, the third worst team in the football league.
I do, however, take comfort that we scored a couple of goals and did appear to make something of the match.
Alas, it's points we need, not performance.
STIP
Friend of torquayfans.com
Just seen Kuffour's handball goal again on Sky. Still no happier about it.
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Scott Brehaut
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Was it obvious enough for the ref and/or assistant to see?Rjc70 wrote:Just seen Kuffour's handball goal again on Sky. Still no happier about it.
STIP
Friend of torquayfans.com
Not sure. Ref wasn't up with play and Cruise may have unsighted the lino. But they have no credit from me for that. Grrr...Scott Brehaut wrote: Was it obvious enough for the ref and/or assistant to see?
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Scott Brehaut
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Arse.
Could have cost us a point.
Could have cost us a point.
STIP
Friend of torquayfans.com
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exiledgull
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So let's have an analysis on this.
There first goal is a handball, the third was a age piece.
Is very hard to blame anyone in this situation, we have a left back playing centre half! In my time watching Torquay in teeny years I've not seen us have such a wafer thin squad and have a lot of injuries all at once. If Downes was playing the awful Nico wouldn't be playing cruise would be left back and Downes is obviously going to be a better centre half. At least Saturday we have a centre half back in there.
Everyone is saying we are 21st in the table, but in terms of budget in our league, are we about were we should be? We've had wage reduction on the squad and now even other staff.
Unfortunately we cannot be expecting points with our team in the way it is at the moment.
We have to be patient get players back fit and go again. We know we have a team in there but when we are missing key players it's very difficult for anyone to do anything.
Pearce career was nearly over 1 week ago so he's not at 100% and when your playing away from home against a strong team what do you all expect? Realism needs to be hit home strongly to a lot of people this morning.
There first goal is a handball, the third was a age piece.
Is very hard to blame anyone in this situation, we have a left back playing centre half! In my time watching Torquay in teeny years I've not seen us have such a wafer thin squad and have a lot of injuries all at once. If Downes was playing the awful Nico wouldn't be playing cruise would be left back and Downes is obviously going to be a better centre half. At least Saturday we have a centre half back in there.
Everyone is saying we are 21st in the table, but in terms of budget in our league, are we about were we should be? We've had wage reduction on the squad and now even other staff.
Unfortunately we cannot be expecting points with our team in the way it is at the moment.
We have to be patient get players back fit and go again. We know we have a team in there but when we are missing key players it's very difficult for anyone to do anything.
Pearce career was nearly over 1 week ago so he's not at 100% and when your playing away from home against a strong team what do you all expect? Realism needs to be hit home strongly to a lot of people this morning.
Sorry, but I don't like this. I am not suggesting that Nicho is playing at the same standard as he was 2 years ago, and i'm not saying he should be playing every week, (Cruise has paid his dues and deserves a run in the team) but to call him awful and insinuate he's a liability is unfair.exiledgull wrote: If Downes was playing the awful Nico wouldn't be playing.
He wasn't awful yesterday, he wasn't as culpable for the goals conceded as other members of our defence have been over the last few games. By all accounts he has had a falling out with the manager and as circumstances would dictate he has been given a second chance, I don't really think he has let us down in those 3 matches, but I am realistic to know that he will be replaced by Cruise once again next week, but not because Nico is 'awful
Everyone says that we are missing Downes and whilst I agree he is a dominant centre half for 90% of the season, he is also by far the most error prone of our defenders. Last season he got sent off on at least 2 occasions, and conceded at least 3 penalties, and if you analyse his defending at close quarters his positioning is often hap-hazard.
People rate Downes because more often or not he can head it 40 yards, puts in a strong tackle, and not afraid to put his head in where it hurts. For a large percentage of the season Downes is an excellent centre back, however (not dissimilar to Mark Ellis) he has lapses in concentration that lead to goals conceded. People tend to overlook the obvious mistakes he makes because he's brave and his strong heading are the most memorable aspects when it comes to analysing how someone has played.
I don't say this to cause arguments or add to the negativity currently present, and I certainly don't say it to denigrate Aaron Downes at all, but I am fed up of Nico being made a scapegoat for all our defensive problems based purely on the fact he is our oldest player. The defence should be judged as a unit and at the moment none of them are coming out with much credit.
Obviously I am aware of the mitigating circumstances regarding our somewhat makeshift back four, especially with the drama concerning Pearce, but for me that is even more ammunition to get behind the players that are playing, instead of slating them. The time to make judgements on certain players is when we have a fully fit squad to choose from and we find ourselves comfortably higher up the league.
That said, the sooner that Downes is back the better. Beckenbauer he is not, but he is a lot better than the alternatives we are being forced to go with.
Being realistic isn't going to get any points though. We are conceding goals like they are going out of fashion. Everyone has been clamouring for the inclusion of Cruise (who was signed as a centre half) - if he plays at left back is he really going to be any better than Nico?
FL seems to be suggesting that Poke wouldn't have let in two of the goals yesterday. Was Rice hesitating? surely not.
We seem to have a team full of nineteen year olds. Yes of course we would be better with Poke and Downes in the team but they are injured.
Somehow we have to beat Mansfield - we cannot afford anymore defeats. This is a league which has Exeter and Morecambe in the top seven. Bar maybe Chesterfield the teams in it are actually no better than last year.
We are in a run of winnable matches no points against the likes of York,Newport and Wycombe is a major worry. Even Hartlepool who were worse than useless when we played them and they are hammering everybody now.
FL seems to be suggesting that Poke wouldn't have let in two of the goals yesterday. Was Rice hesitating? surely not.
We seem to have a team full of nineteen year olds. Yes of course we would be better with Poke and Downes in the team but they are injured.
Somehow we have to beat Mansfield - we cannot afford anymore defeats. This is a league which has Exeter and Morecambe in the top seven. Bar maybe Chesterfield the teams in it are actually no better than last year.
We are in a run of winnable matches no points against the likes of York,Newport and Wycombe is a major worry. Even Hartlepool who were worse than useless when we played them and they are hammering everybody now.
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AustrianAndyGull
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Also apologies to those around me yesterday, when I got back in the car I noticed a distinct aroma of body odour which must have been detected by the various people's olfactory mechanisms of those closest to me therefore I can now say sorry if this offending odour upset anyone. I do use deodorant normally i'll have everyone know!!
Strangely enough it was Pope Gregory the 9th inviting me for drinks aboard his steam yacht, the saucy sue currently wintering in montego bay with the England cricket team and the Balanese Goddess of plenty.
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AustrianAndyGull
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Oh and also, their programme was awful AND I won £80 on the lotto hotpicks!! 26 and 33, 2 numbers 2 lines and BINGO!!
Strangely enough it was Pope Gregory the 9th inviting me for drinks aboard his steam yacht, the saucy sue currently wintering in montego bay with the England cricket team and the Balanese Goddess of plenty.
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