FA Cup Round 1, Torquay vs Rochdale 9/11/13

[wodger of awabia]

What was the matter with the ref? Couple of odd decisions, but then, that's standard L2 fare these days. I don't see that he's worthy of particular criticism.

Wodger, you're only allowed three subs. If he'd used DM, you'd have been here complaining that he didn't use Craig.

Matt.

Don't be so silly Matt! you know very well that I was not suggesting that we should be allowed to use four subs!

[ferrarilover]

Ahahaha

[cjhdale]

Consider yourselves lucky you are out !! At least you dont have to go to Rotherham in the 2nd round !!

[Scott Brehaut]

Consider yourselves lucky you are out !! At least you dont have to go to Rotherham in the 2nd round !!

Yeah, you're right. We're all delighted we are out....

[arcadia]

What a pathetic, gutless performance, feel sorry for the odd player who clearly cares....Downes, Rice , O'conner ......the rest can take a running jump

Once again no leadership on the pitch (for Christ sake Mansell stand aside as captain will you....you are just not a leader)

The bottom lines is I don't think many of the players actually want to be playing for Torquay

Loanees forced to come here on loan and players who failed to get contracts at other clubs and hence Torquay was their only chance of staying in the league.

Some of you may be old enough to remember our cup exit against Bognor Regis, I was there, we got played of the park, but the thing I will always remember was 2 or 3 of the Torquay team that day in tears after the match
I just wish today's team cared as much

Mansell was the only player giving a lead in our side, think you talking -rap.

[arcadia]

Respect your opinion but I must disagree with you Mid, I saw it as the complete opposite.

I thought a triple substitution reeked of desperation from a manager who was lost as to how to tweak things for the positive. He could have introduced a substitute on the 60th, 70th and 80th minutes and given them time to adapt to their individual roles, all 3 at once just confused matters. I just don't think he knew what to do to inspire the team.

Hawley and Cameron barely touched the ball in their time on the pitch, whereas Craig (out of position) kept hitting it forward in the air. Unless done when the match is sewn up and won, triple subs rarely, if ever, work.

I am not a Knill basher and know the importance of getting behind the club, the boss, the players no matter how much sh**e is thrown our way, but if that was a team playing with confidence, inspired to get an important win, and who had a sense of purpose or idea of what they should be doing, then we are in a lot of trouble!

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[ferrarilover]

Not necessarily. You can view the sub whichever way you like. It was either desperation or it was a bold move from a man confident (quite rightly, based on the previous 80 minutes) that Rochdale were extremely unlikely to score and that a big, strong move might just be enough to upset them into conceding an odd goal. At the very least, it might be enough to throw them off their stride sufficiently to stem their forward play and force them to accept the draw.

Matt.

[ferrarilover]

I think you're both wrong. Manse had an alright game yesterday, a lot of strong work in the middle of the park. That said, I expect more of a leader than simple waving arms about and shouting at people, it requires more nous than that. So, football, alright. Leadership, not so much.

Matt.

[arcadia]

Not necessarily. You can view the sub whichever way you like. It was either desperation or it was a bold move from a man confident (quite rightly, based on the previous 80 minutes) that Rochdale were extremely unlikely to score and that a big, strong move might just be enough to upset them into conceding an odd goal. At the very least, it might be enough to throw them off their stride sufficiently to stem their forward play and force them to accept the draw.

Matt.

I just felt McCourt should have been taken off, the substitutions (In my opinion) were done in the wrong way. Chapell should have stayed on, it was a bit like Morcombe and Wise, Knill sent three on but in the wrong order if you know what I mean. It made me think that he can't read the game!

[nickbrod]

Phew! Lucky us we've avoided an away tie in Round 2 at Rotherham as this is Rochdale's 'reward'. Our record against sides run by Steve Evans isn't great so what a relief!
Oh by the way, Saturday's opponents, Chesterfield are playing at home on Tuesday night in the Johnstone's Paint Trophy against ...Rochdale. The result could be a pointer to our chances on Saturday.

[ferrarilover]

I didn't see much football from him other then watching the opposition pass it around as he over committed and was sold a dummy time and time again.

I would rather have downes with the armband.

We shall have to agree to disagree on the first line and agree to agree (vehemently) on the second.

Matt.

[ferrarilover]

I concur, Arc, the McCourt should have been removed. For me, he is the biggest turd in the cesspool at the moment. I understand perfectly your M&W analogy (what a bizarre thing, I love this forum), he played all the right notes (make a triple sub) but not necessarily in the right order (take off Chapperz).

Matt.

[ferrarilover]

Sounds like a joke, but the first thing I said when I saw it was Rotherham away was thank God we are out. If we're going to lose (and, as likely as not, we would lose at Rotherham), we might as well lose early and at home. Not ideal in many ways, but this, at least, represents a very small mercy.

Matt.

[Plymouth Gull]

Not necessarily. You can view the sub whichever way you like. It was either desperation or it was a bold move from a man confident (quite rightly, based on the previous 80 minutes) that Rochdale were extremely unlikely to score and that a big, strong move might just be enough to upset them into conceding an odd goal. At the very least, it might be enough to throw them off their stride sufficiently to stem their forward play and force them to accept the draw.

Matt.

You say Rochdale were unlikely to score, but were they? The looked more threatening than we did, had the ball in our half more than their own, had a goal disallowed, forced Rice into more action than Lillis (I think that's his name - he only touched the ball the once so I did forget about him). The treble substitution is always a big risk, I felt a double substitution 10 minutes earlier would have sufficed personally - I never feel comfortable using all 3 subs in one go though as it leaves you with a headache if anything goes wrong (injury/red card etc).

Rochdale came with a game plan and played it to a tee. They started with 5 at the back, with three central defenders. We saw this, and thought it'd be good to lump it up to McCallum (who struggled) but he was always up against two defenders in the aerial battle so it isn't a surprise we lost it. The only times we really looked like causing concern was when we got the ball out to the flanks and got some crosses in. Chapell caused a few problems but it wasn't really running for him. Once Knill threw the three subs on, Keith Hill soon responded by bringing on a winger for his right back. This change from what I assume was a 5-4-1 (Henderson and Vincenti on the wings supporting Hogan), to a 4-4-2 (Henderson going upfront), worked perfectly. The assist for the opener came from the substitute Matty Done, who escaped the attentions of Nicholson (which wasn't hard on yesterday's showing), and he cut it back for Hogan for an easy finish. Those substitutions changed the game for us - once Hill realised we had thrown the dice with all subs, he and his recognised what they could do to counter this and got it spot on.

Now, in another post you mention McCourt being awful - I find this one interesting as I thought he outshone Mansell yesterday. For an 18 year old he has a mature footballing mind for his age, and I reckon if he sticks at it, he could get a career in the top two tiers.

As I said yesterday (and has since been picked up by other posters - recall NickBrod saying it on another thread), our back four should be O'Connor at right back, Downes, Pearce and Cruise. Tonge and Nicholson are not up to the required level to be starting every week in my opinion. O'Connor can't be bad at right back, infact he did at least 2 marauding runs from the centre yesterday - in an ideal world the CB doesn't go on long runs like this but he had some of our better opportunities from these yesterday, which says a lot about the state of our game. I'd like to see him given a run out next week instead of Tonge, while Pearce and Downes can be the heart of the defence. Cruise instead of Nicholson should be a given, but for some reason it isn't happening.

I fully expect you to do one of your bit-by-bit breakdowns of this post as you probably disagree with most of it, but we were well beaten yesterday in the end. One thing I do agree on though is that I'm also glad we don't have to face Steve Evans and co!

[arcadia]

The one thing you've got wrong is McCourt was out on his legs and could not make a pass in the last half hour. Knill should have seen this as it happened in the last home game as well. Yes McCourt might go on and make the grade at a higher level but at the moment he is not able to put in a full 90 minutes and it shows. I feel that Knill is lacking in the ability to put things tactically right during the games and yesterday dropped a big clanger by not replacing McCourt as the substitutions were the major factor for us losing the game yesterday.