Is Hargreaves fit for purpose?

Gullscorer · Post by **Gullscorer** » 10 Feb 2015, 23:34

On a few occasions there have been comments to the effect that the manager 'has lost the dressing room'.

It's all nonsense: http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/30900505

Gloomy Gull · Post by **Gloomy Gull** » 11 Feb 2015, 19:08

My answer to that question.......................Never was from the day his name was mentioned..............great player doth not mediocre manager make.

Post by **Dave** » 12 Feb 2015, 12:03

It is not nonsense to suggest a manager can lose the dressing room, of course players do not deliberately go out to lose . If you have players, particularly senior pros who do not like the managers methods, unrest can soon break out amongst the squad, players can become disinterested and training/matchdays players just go through the motions, and results will suffer.

Is there any evidence to suggest managers can lose the dressing room. Yes, how many times has player power forced out a manager quite a few I would suggest, like O'Leary at Leeds after he published a book called 'Leeds United on trial' referring to the Bowyer/Woodgate affair, or Ruud Gullit who publicly fell out with Shearer and club captain Rob Lee, Gullit resigned soon after leaving Shearer out against Sunderland a match they lost 2.1.

Further evidence..http://sabotagetimes.com/reportage/how- ... sing-room/

Not suggesting CH has in any way lost the dressing room here at Torquay, but, I will say performance levels now compared to early in the season are some what concerning to me.

arcadia · Post by **arcadia** » 12 Feb 2015, 13:55

I would say that when a team start a campaign (season) go on a good run it's how they react to their first defeat. It's also how the manager reacts as Hargreaves has no experience and this has been my point all along. The team has only just stopped playing from the back if you've noticed, the players looked uncomfortable with it and I expect they have had an input to the recent changes. This was a step forward but Hargreaves has not learnt that you cannot put Briscoe wide in a front three.
The problem we've got is Chris keeps making the same mistakes.

arcadia · Post by **arcadia** » 12 Feb 2015, 13:55

I would say that when a team start a campaign (season) go on a good run it's how they react to their first defeat. It's also how the manager reacts as Hargreaves has no experience and this has been my point all along. The team has only just stopped playing from the back if you've noticed, the players looked uncomfortable with it and I expect they have had an input to the recent changes. This was a step forward but Hargreaves has not learnt that you cannot put Briscoe wide in a front three.
The problem we've got is Chris keeps making the same mistakes.

brucie · Post by **brucie** » 12 Feb 2015, 15:10

Yes that was a huge mistake against FC United.

Sesimbra · Post by **Sesimbra** » 12 Feb 2015, 16:51

As Hargreaves never admits his mistakes he will never learn from them

Gullscorer · Post by **Gullscorer** » 13 Feb 2015, 14:59

Somebody recently said that the team's successes during Paul Buckle's tenure was in spite of Buckle, not because of him.

If we win the FA Trophy this season, and/or make the play-offs, doubtless somebody will be saying the same about Chris Hargreaves..

kevgull · Post by **kevgull** » 13 Feb 2015, 15:44

Gullscorer wrote:Somebody recently said that the team's successes during Paul Buckle's tenure was in spite of Buckle, not because of him.

If we win the FA Trophy this season, and/or make the play-offs, doubtless somebody will be saying the same about Chris Hargreaves..

Buckle initial managerial success was born from a massive conference budget whilst at Torquay.
Buckle was then sacked by Brizzle and now Cheltenham, more evidence to show he was / is a poor manager.

IMHO CH tatics are poor alongside his game management. However has got a half decent squad and we are still in the comp so who knows what may happen.

Neal · Post by **Neal** » 13 Feb 2015, 16:30

All a bit ridiculous, HE GOT US PROMMOTTED!!

Mourinho, Wenger, Fergy, good managers OR Just have huge budgets!.

Dave_Pougher · Post by **Dave_Pougher** » 13 Feb 2015, 17:12

Whilst I never worry about what happens to PB it does seem his sacking is a bit "timely"

One win in thirteen OK not good stats but can't help feel the bookies just might have stopped taking bets on Gary Johnson getting that particular job.

Such is football I suppose, but is that another managerial appointment mistake for Cheltenham? In my opnion yes GJ's best managerial days are behind him but time will tell.

AustrianAndyGull · Post by **AustrianAndyGull** » 13 Feb 2015, 17:21

Neal wrote:All a bit ridiculous, HE GOT US PROMMOTTED!!

Mourinho, Wenger, Fergy, good managers OR Just have huge budgets!.

Are Mourinho, Fergie and Wenger good managers though?

They can manage with money but what would they achieve say as boss of Tranmere Rovers for example? In my opinion there are three types of manager. The first can manage pressure and success at the very top but have the luxury of the best players and money. Give them the task of steering Telford to safety and you can forget it. The second can only manage teams with limited resources and do it to varying degrees of success. Give them money and invariably they blow it and get the boot.

The third type of manager is Alan Knill.

Buckle certainly knew what he wanted and how to get it and backed up with a few quid too. To be honest, i know the bloke is a complete cretin but it is a little bit odd how he has managed to fail so badly at every other club he has been at since leaving Torquay. Obviously it's funny but strange at the same time.

Hargreaves has had a massively sharp learning curve but no win in the league since December the 9th and have Torquay REALLY got a squad just 4 points better than Braintree? (Braintree also have 2 games in hand).

The FA Trophy is a real bonus but in all honesty, as indicated by many Wrexham fans - unless you are a Dover or an Alfreton, you shouldn't really be judging the season as a success if the play offs aren't reached. I think the club should be a lot closer to the play offs as it stands but i always said given the upheaval, if the club just miss out then that's reasonably all one could have expected at the start of the season.

It will be next season when CH will rightly be 100% held to account. If he is still in charge that is.

arcadia · Post by **arcadia** » 13 Feb 2015, 17:42

Neal wrote:All a bit ridiculous, HE GOT US PROMMOTTED!!

Mourinho, Wenger, Fergy, good managers OR Just have huge budgets!.

IT DOES HELP!

arcadia · Post by **arcadia** » 13 Feb 2015, 17:48

AustrianAndyGull wrote: Are Mourinho, Fergie and Wenger good managers though?

They can manage with money but what would they achieve say as boss of Tranmere Rovers for example? In my opinion there are three types of manager. The first can manage pressure and success at the very top but have the luxury of the best players and money. Give them the task of steering Telford to safety and you can forget it. The second can only manage teams with limited resources and do it to varying degrees of success. Give them money and invariably they blow it and get the boot.

The third type of manager is Alan Knill.

Buckle certainly knew what he wanted and how to get it and backed up with a few quid too. To be honest, i know the bloke is a complete cretin but it is a little bit odd how he has managed to fail so badly at every other club he has been at since leaving Torquay. Obviously it's funny but strange at the same time.

Hargreaves has had a massively sharp learning curve but no win in the league since December the 9th and have Torquay REALLY got a squad just 4 points better than Braintree? (Braintree also have 2 games in hand).

The FA Trophy is a real bonus but in all honesty, as indicated by many Wrexham fans - unless you are a Dover or an Alfreton, you shouldn't really be judging the season as a success if the play offs aren't reached. I think the club should be a lot closer to the play offs as it stands but i always said given the upheaval, if the club just miss out then that's reasonably all one could have expected at the start of the season.

It will be next season when CH will rightly be 100% held to account. If he is still in charge that is.

Buckle was a crap manager but very lucky. His strong points were his nose for a good young player or was it Colin Lee who had this also he must have been a good coach. His bad points where do we start
1. He could not pick a balanced side like another manager we know.
2. He could not read a game hence the stupid substitutions
3 He needed money and can't manage without it.
4. He could not keep his pant up.

Post by **Southampton Gull** » 13 Feb 2015, 18:12

Buckle an eye for a young player? I think you'll find it was John Milton who had that particular skill

Buckle is arrogant to the extreme and that will ultimately always be his downfall.

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