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Judging by the comments attributed to CH in the HE online after yesterday's 2-1 loss he is as frustrated as many on here have become. He admits "that at times some (players) aren't good enough."
He goes on to say, "I need to shuffle the pack in the summer because I want a team that steps on to the field and dominates." He adds: "I've got no excuses."
So what to make of all that? For me it is refreshing to have a manager who is so candid with his comments. He's no different from many posters on here! At least he is telling us how it is rather than some managers who hide behind excuses. To his credit he is honest with his assessments.
I bet Aldershot fans are feeling pretty down at the moment with their manager. Just because we/they were League teams doesn't give us the right to win every game! Yes losing to the likes of Altrincham is disappointing but with the club in seemingly financial meltdown unless there's another lottery winner out there what else can CH or the Board do?
A run in the Trophy would help morale if not a lot of cash but Hemel warmed up yesterday with a thumping 4-1 home win in Conference South. Next Saturday will be their Cup Final against us.

nickbrod wrote:Judging by the comments attributed to CH in the HE online after yesterday's 2-1 loss he is as frustrated as many on here have become. He admits "that at times some (players) aren't good enough."
He goes on to say, "I need to shuffle the pack in the summer because I want a team that steps on to the field and dominates." He adds: "I've got no excuses."

There's nothing wrong with a manager being open and honest. the comments he's made are not refreshing, candid, I'll tell what they are, from a team morale and public relations point of view, comments made by CH are nothing short of suicidal.

Nothing wrong in a manager coming out after a game and saying 'we didn't play well enough today' 'the team weren't at their game today' but to come out an say some of the players aren't good enough, great, so the team are now thinking is that me or the player next to me he's talking about, that's any player with any morale left shot to shat.

And from a P/R point of view, us supporters are now reading the manager say half his team aren't good enough probably getting rid of most of them in the summer, so as far as this seasons concerned CH has given up then I take it, so why should any fan bother parting with £17/21 at the next home game then, I wont be, Eastleigh away next stop for me.

forevertufc wrote: And from a P/R point of view, us supporters are now reading the manager say half his team aren't good enough probably getting rid of most of them in the summer, so as far as this seasons concerned CH has given up then I take it, so why should any fan bother parting with £17/21 at the next home game then, I wont be, Eastleigh away next stop for me.

We're already down to our core supporters, those who will go whatever the weather, whether we're League 1/2/Conference. I don't think the decline in attendances would be so noticeable.

Dockers Pal wrote:Forevertufc, I think we are going through the same angst that so many other former L2 clubs fans have gone through wondering when we will get back into winning ways and promotion. Nearly all the clubs that have fallen further, have done due to financial mismanagement - the exception being Stockport I think.
There are as you point out several more experienced non-league managers and CH has got lessons to learn from their strategies as well as from higher leagues managers.

Again, I'm not disagreeing with you. I do not want financial mismanagement, no body does, nobody is asking for that, but we haven't got the time to wait for an inexperienced manager to learn or for our chairman to lean either, hope I'm wrong but we are heading next season to be more like Aldershot than Barnet, unless things change in terms of investment into the club, or a change of manager to one who knows how to put a team together that can compete at this level.

Not saying we should be going for John Still, our club wouldn't get him, but he's won the conference with D+R and Luton, look where some of his players came from and the fact that he barely paid anything for a lot the players he signed, it's not about spending money, better use of what we do have, which compared to a lot of teams in this league, is still a very decent budget.

Any manager is damned if does or damned if he doesn't speak what he thinks.

He could say there is nothing wrong, just bad luck, some take that PR strategy.
Or he can just speak what he thinks and what we all know. Both will incite ridicule from 1 section of fans.

He has made mistakes yes. So has every other f ing manager we have had. Some posts on here during Buckles reign, jeez and he got us prommoted but that wasn't good enough for some.

We cannot afford to get rid of another manager, that's the bottom line, unless you advocate part time football next season.

I'm behind CH, his not perfect but you know, I'm just so glad we ain't got knill.

I don't care where we are, even conf south, I will still support the club. Some of the best fans in the country go week in week out to clubs like Basingstoke, Farnborough etc etc and just watch football because they love it.

Everyone makes mistakes and its a continual learning process in everything you do, and CH is no different. That doesn't mean actually that at times I won't shout something at a match because of frustration, but when it ends up as continual moaning and undermining that's when it pisses me off

RussianGull wrote: We're already down to our core supporters, those who will go whatever the weather, whether we're League 1/2/Conference. I don't think the decline in attendances would be so noticeable.

Our attendances are noticeable, last four seasons in the league average attendances; 2858/2630/2709/2641. Average attendance for promotion via the play-offs from the conference 2008- 9 was 2325.

Current average attendance 2168 and falling.

Good post Forever. it is often overlooked that the majority of the first team are Hargreaves' players. He keeps bleating on about lack of funds but that is no different to many of the sides in the Conference, some being part-time.
It is noticeable that some of the clubs at the bottom of the table are now winning matches which is more than United are doing.
Hargreaves seems incapable of motivating HIS players and one has to question whether he commands their respect

Neal wrote:Any manager is damned if does or damned if he doesn't speak what he thinks.

Incorrect in my view. Nothing wrong in delivering an honest assessment as to how the game has gone, no manager should come out and say half my players aren't good enough and most will be gone in the summer with 15 games still to play, end of. A skilful manager keeps that to himself.

No wonder the players don't respect CH and play like they want to be somewhere else, what do we or the manager expect when he says things like that in public, he should be talking about a belief these players are capable of making a late run to the play-offs, but hey, he's told us fans as far as this seasons concerned it's over, done and finished, so who can blame any fan for not bothering now, lets hope we do stay in the Trophy now.

forevertufc wrote: Our attendances are noticeable, last four seasons in the league average attendances; 2858/2630/2709/2641. Average attendance for promotion via the play-offs from the conference 2008- 9 was 2325.

Current average attendance 2168 and falling.

Probably because they've died/move away. The core supporters won't stay away.

Sorry Russiangull, but what on earth are you talking about. Was that last post serious or a joke ? If your being serious how many people do you think have died or moved away in the last 6 months, sorry but the current fall in attendances, is already eating into the core support, when was the last time we had a season average gate at 2168 or lower ?

Edit just checked, 2007-8 our first ever season in the conference, average gate was 3125, so did 800 + people die or move away between those two seasons, what actually is our core support level ?

If you take an average between 2000-1 season to the current day, it would a lot higher than 2,000, and that would be taking into account, supporters lost through death and those who've moved away, as new young fans have come into supporting our club.

It was clearly a joke, climb out of your statistics for once forever and lighten up.

We're Torquay, we all know we're rubbish.

Sesimbra wrote:Good post Forever. it is often overlooked that the majority of the first team are Hargreaves' players. He keeps bleating on about lack of funds but that is no different to many of the sides in the Conference, some being part-time.
It is noticeable that some of the clubs at the bottom of the table are now winning matches which is more than United are doing.
Hargreaves seems incapable of motivating HIS players and one has to question whether he commands their respect

i pointed this out earlier (P9 I think).

hes had enough time to look at all the players since hes been here.

he overlooked a CB and played a midfielder at CB - brilliant stratergy......

if fans stood on the pop or sat in the bench or FS can see things are wrong and need changing, why the f**k cant he?

another thing is if he didnt know who was under contract, salaries, abilities etc. when in discussion to take the job then thats another short-coming in his management.

he brought in stevens FFS when no other team wanted him.

Neal wrote:Any manager is damned if does or damned if he doesn't speak what he thinks.

He could say there is nothing wrong, just bad luck, some take that PR strategy.
Or he can just speak what he thinks and what we all know. Both will incite ridicule from 1 section of fans.

He has made mistakes yes. So has every other f ing manager we have had. Some posts on here during Buckles reign, jeez and he got us prommoted but that wasn't good enough for some.

We cannot afford to get rid of another manager, that's the bottom line, unless you advocate part time football next season.

I'm behind CH, his not perfect but you know, I'm just so glad we ain't got knill.

I don't care where we are, even conf south, I will still support the club. Some of the best fans in the country go week in week out to clubs like Basingstoke, Farnborough etc etc and just watch football because they love it.

Everyone makes mistakes and its a continual learning process in everything you do, and CH is no different. That doesn't mean actually that at times I won't shout something at a match because of frustration, but when it ends up as continual moaning and undermining that's when it pisses me off

i think that some posters on here thought he was a bad choice as manager. thats the annoying thing. the key thing was maintaining our league status.

and theres was no way that was going to happen with CH as manager.

RussianGull wrote:It was clearly a joke, climb out of your statistics for once forever and lighten up.

We're Torquay, we all know we're rubbish.

It doesn't read as joke, so I'll let you off this time.. wont climb out of my stats though, currently suggesting relegation for us gulls (seriously) maybe that's why I can't lighten up, as everyone around is giving the we're in mid table just as expected, well lets hope we have an up turn in form then, because at the moment that's not happening.

Super, you're right there. The worst moment of the season for me was stood in the terrace at Alfreton when Richards started as a CB, the world and their dog knows he was too small and incapable of playing there, why on earth nothing was done we will never know. Playing a back three would have even been preferable if he didn't have confidence in young Hutchings.