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Yorkieandy wrote: 29 Apr 2018, 14:18 That makes sense Merse but then 2 things.

Why does he run the football club (and thus a business) in a way in which alienates everyone and excludes everyone. The football club is run functionally rather than enthusiastically which is not going to help you make more money or improve things. Especially when the product is crap.

Why did CO not pull out all the stops to keep the club in the NL in the first place?

Again, it's weird.

A bit like Thea - he is not a footballing man and more than likely was feed misinformation. When Dave Caldwell offered his services last November as the 'writing was on the wall' for relegation, Owers convinced Osborne that he was the man for the job and Osborne brought into it. Owers is still trying to convince us and himself he is still that man.

MellowYellow wrote: 29 Apr 2018, 14:25 A bit like Thea - he is not a footballing man and more than likely was feed misinformation. When Dave Caldwell offered his services last November as the 'writing was on the wall' for relegation, Owers convinced Clarke that he was the man for the job and Clarke brought it. Owers is still trying to convince us and himself he is still that man.

But if that is the case, then I would expect Osborne to sack Owers now because obviously he's let Osborne down as well as lie to him regards his own ability.

He's a successful businessman though and i'd find it hard to believe that a successful businessman would buy a business that he knows absolutely nothing about nor how it should be run, or in fact one where he shows not the slightest bit of interest for.

It could be argued that he has entrusted the management side of things to such incompetents as Harrop and Owers and just backed the wrong horse but again, it's shoddy ownership from a highly astute and clinically brutal businessman.

Plainmoor78 wrote: 29 Apr 2018, 14:29 But if that is the case, then I would expect Osborne to sack Owers now because obviously he's let Osborne down as well as lie to him regards his own ability.

One would have thought so. But then again Owers was not Harrop choice of manager - he was Osbornes - for what reason is still to be unveiled. I have my suspicions, but not (yet) the proof to back it up. As Andy says Osborne is " highly astute and clinically brutal businessman."

Yorkieandy wrote: 29 Apr 2018, 14:31 He's a successful businessman though and i'd find it hard to believe that a successful businessman would buy a business that he knows absolutely nothing about .

Prehaps you might be looking at it from the wrong angle. Did Clarke Osbourn buy the (TUFC) buisness becuase he wanted it, or did he aquire it through default, down to a loan he had in the club, which was on the way to liquidation, thus all of the loan amount lost.

forevertufc wrote: 29 Apr 2018, 14:40 Prehaps you might be looking at it from the wrong angle. Did Clarke Osbourn buy the (TUFC) buisness becuase he wanted it, or did he aquire it through default, down to a loan he had in the club, which was on the way to liquidation, thus all of the loan amount lost.

Good supposition. However what has never been revealed is why Osborne lent the club £120k in the first place. In all honesty at the time the loan was made it never looked like Philips and co would be able to pay it back anyway.

MellowYellow wrote: 29 Apr 2018, 14:01 Good job Tranmere Rovers did not have that outlook after 12 games and only 9 points ahead of us in 18th place. (https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/41290751). Mind you they stuck with their manager and fought off a relegation battle with 82 points; a play-off place and 2rd in the league. Or Flyde for that matter only 8 point ahead of us in 20th place and still managed a play off place.

unless you think we are remaining full-time because he loves the club and football so much. maybe why the rumour of £1M player budget next season

As I'm sure your aware, every season there are clubs that start the season well, and others who drop towards the bottom, these are clubs in false positions, remember our own promotion season 2009, and how we spent the early part of that season in the bottom 4, this wasn't down to a poorly recruited squad, just needed a change of luck, and time for a new squad to settle down.

Not leaving us with a squad that, had cleary no medical checks done, so a goalkeeper signed who can't wave to his family with out getting injured, and a right back with a potentially fatal heart condition, which may have been found sooner, and so on, and on.

Situations that neither Tranmere or Flyde found themselves in, one needed a change of luck the other time to adjust to a new level, unlike us, left in a situation where virtually the entire squad, save for a small handful needed replacing.

Yes, maybe promotion was the aim at the seasons start, all I'm saying, after 10 games it was clear we were going by Christmas, so Owers initial job was to stabilize

No of course I don't think Osbourn is in for the love of the club, in some ways, my opinions don't differ from your own, Had an interesting conversation Tuesday at the ground, of course not saying with whom, but the figure I heard was £1.2 million

Plainmoor78 wrote: 29 Apr 2018, 14:46

Good supposition. However what has never been revealed is why Osborne lent the club £120k in the first place. In all honesty at the time the loan was made it never looked like Philips and co would be able to pay it back anyway.

Agreed, just pointing out that CO didn't buy the club because he wanted it.

Edit, Mellow Yellow, has reminded me of something I had forgot.

Plainmoor78 wrote: 29 Apr 2018, 14:46 Good supposition. However what has never been revealed is why Osborne lent the club £120k in the first place. In all honesty at the time the loan was made it never looked like Philips and co would be able to pay it back anyway.

Osborne's GI pulled out of a bid to buy the club in the summer 2016 because of his instance on the purchase of the freehold of Plainmoor but could not come to a deal with the Council over selling the ground. So he sneaked in the 'back-door; with a loan knowing the clubs financial difficulties and eventually acquired the club by default - or known in the trade as 'got it on the cheap'. If Osborne did not think he had a really good chance of acquiring the freehold of Plainmoor he could have walked away quite easily and took the hit of £120,000. But he continues to pursue his dream and continues to loan more money - rumoured to be £1m for players budget this season - all of which will have to be paid back by the club. So its in Osbornes interest for the club to be successful to get his hands on the freehold of Plainmoor and also the return of his loans to TUFC. Nothing is free in Osbornes venture.

MellowYellow wrote: 29 Apr 2018, 15:09 Osborne's GI pulled out of a bid to buy the club in the summer 2016 because of his instance on the purchase of the freehold of Plainmoor but could not come to a deal with the Council over selling the ground. So he sneaked in the 'back-door; with a loan knowing the clubs financial difficulties and eventually acquired the club by default - or known in the trade as 'got it on the cheap'. If Osborne did not think he had a really good chance of acquiring the freehold of Plainmoor he could have walked away quite easily and took the hit of £120,000. But he continues to pursue his dream and continues to loan more money - rumoured to be £1m for players budget this season - all of which will have to be paid back by the club. So its in Osbornes interest for the club to be successful to get his hands on the freehold of Plainmoor and also the return of his loans to TUFC. Nothing is free in Osbornes venture.

A useful summary, Mellow, and if Osborne assesses that lending a further million for next years budget as more likely to be seen as commitment by those who hold the reigns of the freehold (who will be reminded the Club is unsustainable and may be lost to the Torbay community without the wherewithal to 'build a new stadium' with every additional penny loaned and often) then he would loan that additional money in a heartbeat. Whether the rumour is true about the £1m playing budget, I have no idea. But the last accounts showed the debt position to him and his interests that will have increased since then and increase again. And there was also reference to that company unsustainability within those accounts.

So it's rumoured the debt to Osbourne is around 1m, what a joke, for what?

No way will anyone buy a club at this level with that debt.

Why does a nls club require a 4 man full time management team.

Owers
Kuhl
Harrop
Hedges

Will they get pay cuts in nls, don't think so.

Why, because this club has nothing to do with football.

All they have to do is keep the naive, passive, easily pleased fans off Osbournes case, easy peasey that. Money for old rope. No expectation football wise, just spin the usual crap, they will take it. They are taking the piss out of you.

I would guess that most other clubs have organised their season tickets / pricings for 2018/19, as cash is vital when attempting to assemble a playing budget.

The budget ...is that everything ? Wages ...travel ...food...fuel...accomadation ECT ECT ECT

Hang on plenty of savings next season: no need for overnight trips as all NLS clubs are in reach on match days and player shirts don't have names on their backs!

We can shut down parts of the ground and save on stewards.

Get rid of the Directors box as it won’t be used