Suicide

[Gullscorer]

A man and a woman have been arrested on suspicion of encouraging or assisting a proposed suicide.

Suicide is not a crime. Nor is attempted suicide. So why should it be a crime to encourage or assist somebody to carry out such an action? Of course there will be cases where ulterior motives may be suspected, but, always providing that the person who wishes to die is compos mentis, and that appropriate safeguards are in place to prevent any skulduggery, what is wrong with helping that person to carry out his or her wish to die?

Unfortunately, it appears at present that people have no option to apply for official or judicial confirmation as to the correctness of their actions nor of the state of mind of the person concerned.

Is it beyond the capabilities of our lawmakers to draft an appropriate law? As things currently stand, making it a crime to encourage or assist somebody to do something which is not a crime, also makes the law something of an ass.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide

[ferrarilover]

Well, no, not really. Making suicide illegal is silly beyond words, because it's the only offence for which there could only ever be a zero rate of conviction. However, while not illegal, for this unique reason, suicide is still undesirable, it isn't in the best interests of the state or society for anyone to commit suicide (or so the thinking goes), thus, encouraging someone to do something legal but undesirable ought to be an offence in itself.

For my tuppence, I am pro-choice in all matters. No one else, nor the state,should be taking away my choice to do anything within the bounds of the law. If I wish to abort my unborn child within the Statutory time limits, then I and I alone should have that final decision. Equally, if I so choose, I must be allowed to end my life, or appoint someone to do it for me if I am incapable. Death is the only certainty in life, it is a matter of simple dignity that I may choose the time, place and method of that death, especially if what lies between today and my natural death is particularly unpleasant. I would argue that keeping alive a man counter to his wishes while he is suffering pain constitutes cruel and unusual punishment and that the Convention is being violated. It would fall on it's arse, being that Article 2 is the only utterly Cardinal Article and must supersede any other Article.

Matt.

[Gullscorer]

Yep, agreed.

I would only contend that (a) it should be inconceivable that encouraging/assisting any legal activity other than suicide would be an offence; and (b) in the case of suicide, such encouraging or assisting should be an offence only where the judiciary/officialdom has not given prior authorisation. Obviously if a judge grants permission there will be no offence.

I still feel the law needs updating here, to reflect modern thinking, along with appropriate safeguards, and I should hope that the presenting of information and options to a potential suicide would not normally be regarded as encouragement.

By the way, as you are obviously aware, Article 2 of the ECHR refers to the right to life and Article 3 refers to torture and inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment. Certain politicians want to renege on our commitment to the Convention, which to my mind would be a massive backward step. But then I have thought for a long time that our civilisation is in decline..!!

[ferrarilover]

Euro-sceptics seem to believe everything they read in the DM about the Convention. They fail to realise that our entire way of life, from our most basic freedoms to the fundamentals of life itself, are guaranteed by it. Protecting those liberties is absolutely and entirely worth the price of giving voice to the odd terror suspect or benefit scrounger.

In the situation you describe above, you are correct, in any occurrence other than suicide, it would be wrong to outlaw encouragement of an otherwise lawful activity. Wrong and absurd, frankly.

Recently, following the latest appeal of a group of those wishing to be allowed to die with assistance from friends and family, the panel ordered that the DPP was to launch an investigation into the present state of euthanasia laws in the UK. They, once again, stated that ruling upon euthanasia and related issues was not the place of the Judiciary, rather it was for Parliament to clarify the intention of any legislation they may deem relevant. Parliament will wait for Keir Starmer's report before taking any meaningful action.

I don't think we're too far from a change. The pressure is mounting upon the lawmakers to amend this silly notion (inspired by the Catholic Church) that life is so scared that one may not even kill oneself, even if that means living a life of an actively unpleasant nature. The duty should be upon the State to relieve suffering, where that suffering is particularly real and acute, rather than being upon the State to preserve life at all costs.

The farce of the situation is doubly so by the simple existence of Dignitas.

Matt.

[Gullscorer]

Talking of farce, I suppose the ultimate absurdity would have been to make attempted suicide a capital offence!

Any new legislation will need to be carefully thought out. The right to be able to choose to die is one thing. But if previous laws sought to protect the right to life in an unduly encompassing way, recent criticisms of the Liverpool Care Pathway for the Dying Patient (LCP) have illustrated (indirectly) the potential dangers of straying too far towards the opposite end of the scale. Any changes in legislation brought in to accommodate the right to die must retain a rigorous oversight to avoid an inadvertently excessive relaxation of the law.

[Gullscorer]

By the way, though I absolutely agree that we should not under any circumstances ditch the ECHR, I am also completely against our membership of the EU, which is quite a different issue. But don't get me started on that one here..

[oldpedant]

A man and a woman have been arrested on suspicion of encouraging or assisting a proposed suicide.

Suicide is not a crime. Nor is attempted suicide. So why should it be a crime to encourage or assist somebody to carry out such an action? Of course there will be cases where ulterior motives may be suspected, but, always providing that the person who wishes to die is compos mentis, and that appropriate safeguards are in place to prevent any skulduggery, what is wrong with helping that person to carry out his or her wish to die?

Unfortunately, it appears at present that people have no option to apply for official or judicial confirmation as to the correctness of their actions nor of the state of mind of the person concerned.

Is it beyond the capabilities of our lawmakers to draft an appropriate law? As things currently stand, making it a crime to encourage or assist somebody to do something which is not a crime, also makes the law something of an ass.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide

In the case you mention, the person being 'assisted' may not be aware of what he is agreeing to due to dementia, which is why the police were asked to look into it. Quite right too.

[Gullscorer]

Agreed. A case like that could be tantamount to murder or at least manslaughter, rather than euthanasia, though motive and mens rea will be important here and would need to be established.