Time to drop Manse?

[diamondgirl]

From what I have seen Dale Tonge hasn't set the world alight? perhaps stick Manse back there so he is influencial but not in the engine where we need someone with a few new ideas?

You are joking? Dale has been a bright spot, this season IMHO.

He links up well with Chaps, and has a good engine. Or am I wrong?

[teeboo100]

excellent post diamond girl i also understand that some wont agree and those who dont are certainly entitled to there opinions as they pay there money they are entitled to have there say. However please try to understand that these players are mostly just boys who are paid to do a job in the public eye. I doubt any player gets up and i thinks i know ile play rubbish today cos i want the team to lose and get barracked as i leave the field and then read about what people think of me on public forums. Every player especially the players who are contracted full time to torquay united want results to change as we all do when we pay our money and support. All ime saying is every one of us who supports our special club have a part to play lets start playing that part and support our lads in order to get out of this mess and threat of relegation.

[diamondgirl]

Teeboo100

[limbsofsimb]

You are joking? Dale has been a bright spot, this season IMHO.

He links up well with Chaps, and has a good engine. Or am I wrong?

Dale is decent, but not exceptional

Who would be the better right back out of Manse and Tonge? but we need someone in the back four to bark orders and get Aaron and Krystian into some sort of organised duo (when Aaron is fit and Krystian isnt suffering from his condition). Centre forwards seem to ghost in between the two of them because there is no communication, especially with Pearce who according to sources is a quite gentleman and shows that on the pitch. Perhaps if Manse was back there with them, reading them the riot act for every mistake perhaps we'd be a little more solid there?

[ferrarilover]

Ahahaha, **** me, this place has reached a new level of silliness. Drop Tongue and stick Manse at RB. Ahahahahahahahahahahaha, **** ing hell.

Matt.

[diamondgirl]

Dale is decent, but not exceptional

You have to remember that we are a L2 club. Like it or not we are in the bottom tier of the English football league.

We are only ever going to have/keep "decent" players. Any player more than "decent" will move on (Jamie Ward, Bobby O, Eunan, spring to mind) to bigger, more successful clubs, in a higher league than TUFC. It's sad but it's a fact of life.

Who would be the better right back out of Manse and Tonge? but we need someone in the back four to bark orders and get Aaron and Krystian into some sort of organised duo (when Aaron is fit and Krystian isnt suffering from his condition). Centre forwards seem to ghost in between the two of them because there is no communication, especially with Pearce who according to sources is a quite gentleman and shows that on the pitch. Perhaps if Manse was back there with them, reading them the riot act for every mistake perhaps we'd be a little more solid there?

You simply cannot play a player, in a position that he does not play, just because it would be easier for said player to "bark orders" at his team mates!! No point in reading the riot act everytime a player makes a mistake. It will not work. All that will do is end up with our own players arguing amongst themselves, and probably coming to blows. A captain is not on the pitch to "tell" his fellows professionals "off". It's not a school yard.

I do understand that you, like the rest of us, are thoroughly fed up with our current position, but i'm afaid that what you have suggested is not the answer.

[arcadia]

has anybody actually stopped to think that lee is feeling very down himself about his own performances and the state of our team at the moment do we not think that maby an arm around his shoulders would perhaps do the lad wanders. He is hurting much like the rest of us fans at the moment forget the loan players most of them wont care tuppence yet existing players who have sweat blood for this team are hearing the boos and the general apathy that seams to exist at plainmoor and around some of its fan base. I am not just name dropping but i do know lee mansell to say hello to the man is torquay through and through he cares for this club like we do. Ok hes not playing well and in all fairness probably is not justifying his position yet this man is our captain as a fan whoever turns out in our special clubs shirt deserves to be supported to the hilt. Threads like this one cannot help one bit. Do we not think that members of the team like lee do not occasionally read the forum. So why don't we try as fans to forget our concerns and troubles and for 90 min on sat give our team its manager and staff our very best support we can regardless of the score you never know it may inspire our team to send us all home happy cos ime sure that with the hoards of fans Portsmouth intend to bring they are going to give there team the most vocal support i reckon will visit plainmoor this season.

Good shout mate the team spirit must be low.

[limbsofsimb]

Ahahaha, f**k me, this place has reached a new level of silliness. Drop Tongue and stick Manse at RB. Ahahahahahahahahahahaha, f**k ing hell.

Matt.

To be fair Matt, I would drop him and wouldnt even stick him at rb due to his poor form, but realistically Alan isn't going to is he - so it would be a form of compromise. But, who else have you got in the squad who is a voice on that field? Needs to be some sort of leadership and experience because were gonna struggle to stay up if we just use young loanees. Feel the use of the loan market hasnt been great... could of done with a few unhappy experienced league 1 players rather than young championship potential. Lets just hope Mozika is the answer to all our prayers!

[royalgull]

Drop Manse? Fine ok who comes in? and in all honesty is he any better than Manse? The answer is probably no, our midfielders are much of a muchness from what I've seen although I rate Lathrope higher than our manager does but playing or not playing Damo isn't going to have a massive impact on our side either way in all truth.

There is a point here though buried in this thread, the lack of leaders or more to the point the lack of experience and voices in key areas of the pitch. We've lost Saah who was by all accounts a good leader of the group and Pearce has come in who is still fairly young for a centre back, obviously Downes is injured, Nicholson is probably past his best and then you've got Mansell and after that we are struggling for experience within the group. What we'd give for a Branston type player or just Branston back right now. a warrior centre half who will head and kick everything and not only command the respect of his team mates but drag the others with him. If he'd played in our last 5 games we'd probably be 10th now as he would have dealt with the majority of long balls and crosses that we've continuously conceeded from.

Are there others like him available right now? Not sure, probably not and even if there were we've most probably squandered our dosh on another young striker we barely need.

[bengull]

Hi limbofsimb and welcome to the forum! Kudos on the name, what we wouldn't give to see some of those hypnotising jelly-legged step-overs now!

Thank you for adding something constructive to this thread other than the generic 'sack manse' replies, you have raised some interesting points which have been too hastily ridiculed by some.

As you say, Knill is not going to drop Mansell, we can all debate until the cows come home but he won't, so those clamouring for the all conquering Barcelona-esque midfield duo of Craig and Mozika will have to start seeing it as a valid option.

I agree too that Tonge has not been exceptional;. I accept that he has had a baptism of fire and played in about a hundred different back fours so far, but he can still be held accountable for some of the goals conceded- though normally the blame gets shifted elsewhere: I don't see him as a massive improvement from Oastler.

The defence is a real issue, it has not been addressed all season (not since a fairly useless stand-in manager BUT EXCELLENT defensive coach was shown the door.) On Tuesday I felt like we could concede at any moment, its not the first time this season I've felt like that. I don't think having Downes and Pearce back will make too much of a difference, the defence as a unit has looked shakey all season.

Its not that Mansell can't play RB, its that he doesn't want to. He stated when Bucks left that he wanted to reclaim the midfield spot and that he felt he was playing RB despite being better equipped than the midfielders chosen ahead of him. He actually did a perfectly decent job at right back and if memory serves was part of the defence that broke the clean sheet record.

I would also agree that his communication would enhance the defence, there seems to be very little organisation and leadership back there. We have to go back to basics and build from the back, stop conceding stupid goals. The back line has been all over the place all season!

It seems that Tonge has come in with a decent reputation having played in a promotion winning side and that should be enough to justify his selection. He has been bright in some patches, not so great in others, perhaps knowing his place is under threat (only acknowledged right back at club) may add a bit of extra sparkle to his performances.

There seems to be a real downer on Mansell and Nicholson these days, they are the scapegoats for all our problems. I don't know why they are the easy targets, is it because they have been here the longest? As Teeboo rightly says these are the two who are hurting the most, they are tufc through and through, they have seen and done it before, they know exactly what ramifications relegation would have on the club. They are both not only playing for their next football contract, but also the chance to stay in the town where they have their families settled. These times of austerity and struggle are no less unsettling for them as it is for us.

Two years ago they were both EXCEEPTIONAL- as recognised by their peers. Their standard has dropped, they are no longer exceptional but they are still good pros at this level and certainly no weaker than anyone else in the squad, yet still they get heckled and abused.

I stayed to clap the players off on Tuesday - most had left. Nicholson came right over to the 18 yard line, he looked distraught, apologetic, a man hurting just as much as me. Nicho tried to drag some of the young loanees over to the fans, they shrugged their shoulders and told him to sod off- they didn't want to know. Only Manse, Rice and Nico saluted the away end.

As Teeboo say morale is at an all-time low, harmony is at an all time low, confidence in at an all time low. There looks to be little in the way of team spirit. Manse and Nico are still the heartbeat of our team, they continue to get picked week in, week out, they are the biggest influences in the dressing room. Could the fact that they are bearing the brunt of the criticism be having an adverse effect on performance and team spirit?

We HAVE to get behind them. We can't allow this atmosphere to get worse.

[AustrianAndyGull]

Hey Ben, I stayed behind and clapped the lads off the pitch too but then again I only had a 40 minute drive back home. :na:

[ethantufcbaker]

has anybody actually stopped to think that lee is feeling very down himself about his own performances and the state of our team at the moment do we not think that maby an arm around his shoulders would perhaps do the lad wanders. He is hurting much like the rest of us fans at the moment forget the loan players most of them wont care tuppence yet existing players who have sweat blood for this team are hearing the boos and the general apathy that seams to exist at plainmoor and around some of its fan base. I am not just name dropping but i do know lee mansell to say hello to the man is torquay through and through he cares for this club like we do. Ok hes not playing well and in all fairness probably is not justifying his position yet this man is our captain as a fan whoever turns out in our special clubs shirt deserves to be supported to the hilt. Threads like this one cannot help one bit. Do we not think that members of the team like lee do not occasionally read the forum. So why don't we try as fans to forget our concerns and troubles and for 90 min on sat give our team its manager and staff our very best support we can regardless of the score you never know it may inspire our team to send us all home happy cos ime sure that with the hoards of fans Portsmouth intend to bring they are going to give there team the most vocal support i reckon will visit plainmoor this season.

withouth manse there is no leadership its the formation player selection nothing just revolves around manse because of the poor performance that lays deeper in moral and tactics

[limbsofsimb]

Hi limbofsimb and welcome to the forum! Kudos on the name, what we wouldn't give to see some of those hypnotising jelly-legged step-overs now!

Thank you for adding something constructive to this thread other than the generic 'sack manse' replies, you have raised some interesting points which have been too hastily ridiculed by some.

Thanks Bengull, just a tad bored of negative comments regarding the old guard! They may not be the force they were but least they lay their bodies down on the line! Gotta keep the faith for Sat.

[Glostergull]

I didn't think that Nico had any worse a game than any one else on the pitck at Burton. He dealt with many sitations coolly. Our main problems was that for some reason we didn't seem to get any quality going forward, we seemed to put too much pressure on ourselves at the back by not doing anything positive up front. I'm no expert but if we don't score then the defense is then asked to do too much.

[tomogull]

Time to drop Manse ? NOOOOOOOOO !!!!!!!