Ready for criticism

[holsten]

Hi all,

I'm coming on here to post about a new idea a few Torquay fans have had and swung into action. You look at MOST English clubs, for example Man City in Europe, and it's shambolic. The other week the Ajax fans put the City fans to shame in their own back yard. It happened last year against United at O.T too, but it's not just Ajax. All teams I've seen British clubs play in Europe, with a minute few exceptions, have made more noise regardless of the scoreline. This is what football's become. Back in the 80's, English clubs had the best fans in Europe by far, but we all know that this is no more. I think a lot of English fans have noticed this, even City and Argyle.

We've decided to form a group called the Torquay Fanatics - the name shows us what we're about at first glance and doesn't encourage any violence! I know what you're all thinking, a few years back a few of us tried to find the 'Torquay Ultras' but had absolutely no idea what to do. With the exception of SG donating some flags which were gratefully recieved, most didn't like the name and we decided to rename it the Yellow Army, but nothing's really happened since then.

The whole idea of the group is ultimately to improve the atmosphere at Plainmoor. However, we are not, under any circumstances, trying to alienate any supporters or create a seperate group. About a year ago, around 20 fans made a private Facebook group under the name 'Torquay Fanatics TF12' and have discussed ideas. We don't want to recieve negative feedback right at the start, so we've discussed on end what and what not to encourage. We like the name, it's simple and effective, without trying to pretend we're Italian. We hope all can agree on that.

Exeter formed the Siege Army in 2011, and this is what they've achieved. I hate to say it, but you can't knock what they've achieved so far.





That's just 3 of hundreds.

Argyle are also doing the same, with the Forza Verde.

http://fv1886.co.uk/ (won't let me copy the pics)

ANYWAY, we've formed this group with obvious intentions, and encourage all the get involved. We've had a few flags made already, and are looking at a LOT of flags that will be coming to the Moor very soon! We've set up a website, and a separate bank account. WE WILL NOT BE CREATING A FORUM as this is the forum we encourage all Torquay fans to use and it would be a sign of trying to distance from other Torquay fans, something we are ABSOLUTELY against.

What we've already achieved and what we are planning
- We've set up a site (www.torquayfanatics.eu) [still under construction]
- Facebook 'Search 'Torquay Fanatics TF12'
- Twitter @TorquayFanatics
- BANK ACCOUNT - This has been set up for all group transactions, just like City and Argyle.

- New Flag (already printed, arriving tomorrow/wednesday). Designed by purecanvascompany. 10ftx3ft PVC banner. Printed in HIGH RES. (picture cuts off the end of the flags, which like the other side, says tf12 down the side)


We've also designed a number of other flags. Most of our flags orders will be coming from http://www.ultrasshop.com, however, we will be making some. They sell all sorts on their, foil sheets for displays, single or multiple coloured flags, scarves, the list goes on.

Sorry it's a bit of a read, but I hope you all see our intentions and can help back the revolution!

[AustrianAndyGull]

Amazing stuff walshy, i,ve been to few matches in Austria and especially Rapid Vienna and all you can see are flags being waved, banners everywhere and they sing and bounce for 90 minutes. Not a chorus here and one there, the FULL length of the game they are at it. Admittedly they went ott when they brought out the firecrackers and other assorted pyrotechnics but generally speaking their fans would support the team like this every week home and away.

Supporting an English team, especially a lower league team like Torquay and you have to expect the atmosphere to be minimal but it doesn't have to be. The flags and paraphernalia serve as a visual and active reminder of our support during a game and i'd be up for it no doubt. Getting a pocket of fans together in this way would generate more atmosphere and dispel the myth of Torquay fans being a sleepy bunch from a sleepy town.

Like walshy says, the idea is not to go round caving peoples heads in at random but to just create a more partizan atmosphere at games both home and away. Oh and i remember the Ultras lads, i went to Accy with a mate and was stood directly in front of the flag at the back of the stand and next to me were a grandad and a little girl! I kept thinking how funny it was when you have say hundreds of Roma fans with tops off, skinheads and fireworks leaning on fences over the Ultras flags and we have a grandad with his little girl in front of ours!! Hilarious! Seriously though, i thought the Ultras name itself did lend itself and associate itself with hooliganism so i reckon you've made the right choice changing it.

[holsten]

Amazing stuff walshy, i,ve been to few matches in Austria and especially Rapid Vienna and all you can see are flags being waved, banners everywhere and they sing and bounce for 90 minutes. Not a chorus here and one there, the FULL length of the game they are at it. Admittedly they went ott when they brought out the firecrackers and other assorted pyrotechnics but generally speaking their fans would support the team like this every week home and away.

Supporting an English team, especially a lower league team like Torquay and you have to expect the atmosphere to be minimal but it doesn't have to be. The flags and paraphernalia serve as a visual and active reminder of our support during a game and i'd be up for it no doubt. Getting a pocket of fans together in this way would generate more atmosphere and dispel the myth of Torquay fans being a sleepy bunch from a sleepy town.

Like walshy says, the idea is not to go round caving peoples heads in at random but to just create a more partizan atmosphere at games both home and away. Oh and i remember the Ultras lads, i went to Accy with a mate and was stood directly in front of the flag at the back of the stand and next to me were a grandad and a little girl! I kept thinking how funny it was when you have say hundreds of Roma fans with tops off, skinheads and fireworks leaning on fences over the Ultras flags and we have a grandad with his little girl in front of ours!! Hilarious! Seriously though, i thought the Ultras name itself did lend itself and associate itself with hooliganism so i reckon you've made the right choice changing it.

Cheers mate!

Yeah we're working on new flags at the moment. Our next order will be quite big, already recieved a few donations off the founding group of lads, just decided what is the next thing. Probably getting 3 or 4 yellow/blue hand flags and a few 2-stick flags. Also considering getting 100 foil sheets, only 10euros, for the display against City, although that's just an idea atm.

[ferrarilover]

Oh God, not this again. Walshy, I love your enthusiasm, it's brilliant, but Torquay is supported basically by a couple of thousand VERY OLD MEN, none of whom have the will, desire nor capability to make like St Pauli for 90 minutes. They want to turn up, sit down, suck a Werther's Original and complain about the price of tea.
I wish you the very best of luck in your ambition, but you are doomed to failure. I have enjoyed a couple of excellent days out with the Back Step Army, but save for on very rare occasions, the atmosphere at home games is subdued and quiet. Not necessarily a bad thing, but not likely to change, either.


Matt.

[holsten]

Oh God, not this again. Walshy, I love your enthusiasm, it's brilliant, but Torquay is supported basically by a couple of thousand VERY OLD MEN, none of whom have the will, desire nor capability to make like St Pauli for 90 minutes. They want to turn up, sit down, suck a Werther's Original and complain about the price of tea.
I wish you the very best of luck in your ambition, but you are doomed to failure. I have enjoyed a couple of excellent days out with the Back Step Army, but save for on very rare occasions, the atmosphere at home games is subdued and quiet. Not necessarily a bad thing, but not likely to change, either.


Matt The n00b.

Don't you just hate that, though? English Football is doomed by shite support, and you look at ALL European clubs who make a hell of a lot of noise, and behind all those clubs is a small group that don't stop for 90 minutes. I respect your comments, just disagree that change cannot be brought.

Walshy

[AustrianAndyGull]

Oh God, not this again. Walshy, I love your enthusiasm, it's brilliant, but Torquay is supported basically by a couple of thousand VERY OLD MEN, none of whom have the will, desire nor capability to make like St Pauli for 90 minutes. They want to turn up, sit down, suck a Werther's Original and complain about the price of tea. I wish you the very best of luck in your ambition, but you are doomed to failure. I have enjoyed a couple of excellent days out with the Back Step Army, but save for on very rare occasions, the atmosphere at home games is subdued and quiet. Not necessarily a bad thing, but not likely to change, either.


Matt The n00b.

F*cking magic Matt, made me smirk a bit that.

I must admit i'm now well into my 30's and have collected a few ailments along the way and there ain't a hope in hell i'm gonna be jumping anywhere without arresting ( my heart that is, not me personally by the police :~D ) but i reckon i can sing for 90 minutes with regular Werthers breaks in between.

This idea might only amount to a small section of us but if we sing for twice as long, twice as loud and rack up flags and banners all over the shop then it will have a definate positive effect on the atmosphere at games and show other fans that we are Torquay and we are proud to shout about it. If the OAP's want to sit well away and sip on a cuppa for 90 minutes inbetween denture removals then good for them and they are just as much supporters as everyone else. Every paying spectator who sets foot inside Plainmoor or an away ground on a matchday is as equal to the rest of us but let the youth get on with making going to football like it should be. Give it a few years and i'll be cracking open a bumper size family pack of mint humbugs as my matchday highlight!

[ferrarilover]

Ok, I'll run with this just a little longer.

We have no real atmosphere at Plainmoor, why is that? Is it because we don't have enough flags? No. Is it because people really want to sing, but don't know the words? No. Is it because there isn't already a small section of youngsters on the Pop side who are happy to start chants? No. It's because the average age of a Torquay resident and therefore a Torquay attendee is 1756.8 years. People that old don't want to sing, they don't want to cheer. That wasn't what you did during the War, so that's not what needs doing today.
If you want to change the atmosphere, you need to change what is responsible for the atmosphere and what is responsible for the atmosphere is the people in attendance. If you have a sure fire way of attracting an extra couple of thousand youngsters into the ground, please don't waste your time on here, fire off an E-Mail to Andy Candy and let's double the numbers.

How, exactly, do you propose to change the atmosphere, beyond having a MyFace group which, surprise surprise, the overwhelming majority of very, very old Torquay supporters will never see?

Matt.

As an aside, if it were me, I'd get Delia in, she worked wonders on the Norwich mob a few years ago :~D

[AustrianAndyGull]

I think you make some very salient points there Matt and you are probably correct in that the fans who go to Plainmoor week in week out and sing will do so anyway and to make anymore noise and atmosphere there needs to be a major uptake to the 'Fanatics' movement from exisiting attendees ( ie fans who go each week now but don't sing and suddenly decide TO sing and join the group ). This number of these 'existing' fans who are likely to do this is probably zero.

Or we need some new blood, especially from the youth in the area who have the energy, passion and sense of fun that Plainmoor would welcome. This would have a two-fold effect whereby the 'fanatics' movement gets new members and the numbers grow and the noise gets louder. Plus the gates go up and more money comes into the club. Like you say, there is already a small section of fans on the pop ready to start chants so essentially the ones who care enough about Torquay AND the singing are already in there on a weekly basis anyway. Therefore the likelihood of a new movement bringing in new fans to the club is again, probably zero. So in effect what Walshy and co are doing is highly unlikely on the balance of probability to generate any additional interest than the fans who are already doing what they wish to do so on the face of it you may think it is a complete waste of time.

Clearly Walshy and the boys have a passion for Torquay and a passion for singing and chanting at games and so do i therefore any enhancement of this via purely aesthetic means such as flags and banners in abundance is a great idea and we've got to commend them for actually getting off their arses and trying to do something positive for themselves, the other fans, the club and the players. I don't know how successful the idea will be, how long it will last or how many ( if any ) new singers they will recruit but i'm in for most of the away games anyway ( unless i have flu and then you'll find me sat on the end of a far and distant row of seats looking like death and most probably mistaken for a vagrant who has mistakenly gained entry! Believe me, that happens quite a lot! The flu i mean, not looking like a tramp. ). On the rare excursions i make to Plainmoor then i'll be in should i know where to find you all and should i not have flu! Last few times i have stood right at the far end near where the players come out. Give the lads some credit for at least trying, it's more than Martin Ling gives the club anyway and he gets f*cking paid!!

[holsten]

Ok, I'll run with this just a little longer.

We have no real atmosphere at Plainmoor, why is that? Is it because we don't have enough flags? No. Is it because people really want to sing, but don't know the words? No. Is it because there isn't already a small section of youngsters on the Pop side who are happy to start chants? No. It's because the average age of a Torquay resident and therefore a Torquay attendee is 1756.8 years. People that old don't want to sing, they don't want to cheer. That wasn't what you did during the War, so that's not what needs doing today.
If you want to change the atmosphere, you need to change what is responsible for the atmosphere and what is responsible for the atmosphere is the people in attendance. If you have a sure fire way of attracting an extra couple of thousand youngsters into the ground, please don't waste your time on here, fire off an E-Mail to Andy Candy and let's double the numbers.

How, exactly, do you propose to change the atmosphere, beyond having a MyFace group which, surprise surprise, the overwhelming majority of very, very old Torquay supporters will never see?

Matt The n00b.

As an aside, if it were me, I'd get Delia in, she worked wonders on the Norwich mob a few years ago :~D

The average age of Torquay fans may be higher than other clubs, but rather than 2500 people who don't want to sing, I think it's more like 2500 waiting to sing, like lost sheep. Look at Palace, they have inspired a whole fanbase up there, and after starting in '05 they have become one of the best sets of supporters in the country.

[Dutchgull]

Best of luck to you Walshy ! I am watching the Bundesliga highlight show at the moment and every ground there seems to have flag wavers and a great atmosphere. Ignore the negativity above and go for it. It will be hard but you have to start somewhere !

[OllieGull]

Massively agree with all of this and yes most of the European clubs put England clubs to shame. The Dortmund fans are a good example of this:
But yeah good luck mate would love to see a better atmosphere at Plainmoor.

[holsten]

Cheers fellas. Rome wasn't built in a day, but I really do believe that if the small group of 20 or so that are passionately backing idea help bring in new flags, displays and ultimately noise, it would encourage existing fans to join in and new fans alike.

[stevegull]

I disagree with the criticism of English football as a whole. Sure, the atmosphere at Plainmoor isn't always amazing but if you look elsewhere in England then I think we put the other European supporters to shame.

For example, I was watching some terrible Spainish team play Barcelona in La Liga the other day. And this fairly poor Spanish side (sad i forgot the name) couldn't even get close to filling their stadium. And this is a common problem in Spain's top league. Even when the 'big boys' of Barcelona and Real Madrid come to town they can't fill their stadium. Then look at teams like Blackpool and Reading who have risen to the top flight and filled their stadium consistantly, even when Wigan come to town!

I also think the Stoke fans represented English football fans tremendously well in the Europa League last season. They were loud to the very end, even when Villareal played them off the park. They were happy to be there; and loving every moment.

Sure some clubs like Wigan don't fill their ground but I think this problem is far less common in England. Foreign players and managers always make reference to playing in front of packed stadiums as their reason for loving the English game.

Back to Torquay though and it would be nice for a better atmosphere and I wish you every success; no matter how hard it will ultimately be. Just make sure you don't alienate those 'old boys' that have followed our club for many years. They are the lifeblood of our club.

[ferrarilover]

Walshy, mate, you are an inspiration to us all. Your last reply demonstrates that if nothing else, blind optimism will see us through and I absolutely love that. Sat here chuckling to myself. Best of luck to you.

Matt.

[PhilGull]

Ok, I'll run with this just a little longer.

We have no real atmosphere at Plainmoor, why is that? Is it because we don't have enough flags? No. Is it because people really want to sing, but don't know the words? No. Is it because there isn't already a small section of youngsters on the Pop side who are happy to start chants? No. It's because the average age of a Torquay resident and therefore a Torquay attendee is 1756.8 years. People that old don't want to sing, they don't want to cheer. That wasn't what you did during the War, so that's not what needs doing today.
If you want to change the atmosphere, you need to change what is responsible for the atmosphere and what is responsible for the atmosphere is the people in attendance. If you have a sure fire way of attracting an extra couple of thousand youngsters into the ground, please don't waste your time on here, fire off an E-Mail to Andy Candy and let's double the numbers.

How, exactly, do you propose to change the atmosphere, beyond having a MyFace group which, surprise surprise, the overwhelming majority of very, very old Torquay supporters will never see?

Matt The n00b.

As an aside, if it were me, I'd get Delia in, she worked wonders on the Norwich mob a few years ago :~D

Well true, because there wasn't any football during the war. But look back at old footage of games. When these old guys were youngsters there were more of them and they made more noise. They have gotten old and we have gotten apathetic.

Well done Walshy, Now Gulls, BRING THE NOISE!